E382 Birthday Bummers and Haunted Emo Cowboys
TOPICS: The O.K. Corral and Boothill Cemetery, Kylen Schulte and Crystal Turner
Boothill ghost photo
Closeup of the Boothill ghost
Crystal Turner (left), Kylen Schulte (right) and their bunny Ruth.
It's episode 382, it's our birthdays and we're enduring some dusty water! This week Em has a surprise birthday story for Christine in the ghosts of the O.K. Corral. Then Christine covers the tragic murders of queer couple Kylen Shutle and Crystal Turner. Happy birthdays to us! Always choose the bear... and that's why we drink!
Transcript
[music]
[noise]
Christine: Hi.
Em: Hi. Ask me why I drink.
Christine: My name is...
Em: Oh.
Christine: My name... Uh, why do you drink?
Em: Umm, because I thought I was able to put backgrounds on this as a backdrop for Riverside.
Christine: Yeah. Uh-huh.
Em: I'm realizing I can't do that.
Christine: Why? What do you mean?
Em: I... I can't figure out how to put a picture behind me, but I...
Christine: Ohh, like how Microsoft does, or like Zoom?
Em: Like Zoom backgrounds, yeah. I can't do that, and I... Let's just say I did a thing.
Christine: What?
Em: Happy birthday.
Christine: Is this our... Ahh! [chuckle] It's our birthday episode? Oh no. [laughter] I'm such a bad friend. I forgot.
Em: I made a whole background. I stayed up until 6:00 AM mastering it.
Christine: That's insane. Umm, and I feel so loved. [chuckle]
Em: I'm...
Christine: Even though I can't see it.
Em: So pissed. I'm so pissed. I lost so much sleep, because I thought this is going to fucking crack Christine up.
Christine: Okay, well, is there... Do you have like an iPad... Your phone, you can hold up the picture so I can at least see it? Or, or no?
Em: Well, Eva, is there a way on your end I could send it to you as like the host and you could...
Christine: No, I'm the host.
Em: Is there...
Christine: Sorry to say.
Em: You're the host? Fuck. Let's just try it...
Christine: So you, I have to...
Em: Let's just try it with a basic one, let's...
Christine: You have to get past me.
Em: Okay. I'm gonna see if I can send it to you, and see if...
Christine: It says I can upload a logo. Oh yeah, Eva said share your screen maybe?
Em: No, it's not this...
Christine: You wanna do that?
Em: I'm just gonna... We're gonna try. This is not the one that passed, but I want to see...
Christine: Okay, now...
Em: Could you put... Can you try to put that as a background for us?
Christine: Uh, no. Wait. What? No. [chuckle]
Em: I didn't know if like as the host you were in control of backgrounds where nobody else...
Christine: Oh, no, no. I don't think so. I just don't think that's a feature on here.
Em: Fuck!
Christine: I'm sorry, but thank you for sending a picture of confetti to the group chat. [chuckle]
Em: That was the backup one if the first one didn't work, and kelsa preeze, neither of them work. Fuck. Okay, well.
Christine: Why would the first one not work and the second one did work? Or like...
Em: Christine, just shhh. Just trust. Just...
Christine: I'm just wondering. What was the other one?
Em: You'll find out with the... Shut...
Christine: I wanna see it!
Em: Just shut, shut, shut the fuck up. I... You'll figure it out in a second. Just hang on a second. I can't say anything yet. Just relax. It's okay. You're gonna be excited.
Christine: Can I see it? [laughter]
Em: Even if it's just a picture I sent. Ugh.
Christine: Please.
Em: Christine. I had a... All...
Christine: Leona just, Leona just learned "please", and it's very annoying.
Em: Oh, guess who she learned that from? You.
Christine: Oh, I was like, Bluey? I don't know. [chuckle] Oh, me.
Em: You say that all the time, especially when you want...
Christine: Please.
Em: Someone to get off the couch and do something for you 'cause you don't want to get off the couch. [chuckle]
Christine: Please, pretty please.
Em: Oh man. I'm so bummed. Anyway, I wanted it to be special, but happy birthday Christine.
Christine: I love my hat that you're wearing in honor of our birthdays.
Em: I, I... The reason I made us record later is because I had to go to Party City, 'cause I wanted to get a hat for you. So...
Christine: You don't have them just laying around? I feel like I've just collected all mine over the years.
Em: No.
Christine: They're just in a box.
Em: No, I don't... This is... I don't.
Christine: You throw them away every time?
Em: I don't... I never own them. If I...
Christine: Oh.
Em: I just never... This is my first birthday hat.
Christine: I dunno why I've always owned party hats.
Em: Umm.
Christine: Maybe from my dog.
Em: I like to... I think I try to decorate with things that can be like recycled, and I know that I'll never wear a hat so there's no point 'cause it'll... You know, kind of defeats the purpose. But...
Christine: What about all those like random shit you left in my house, like that giant inflatable coffin?
Em: That explains why you keep recycling things, because I just leave garbage in your house.
Christine: Yeah, well. [laughter] You were like, "Surprise! Anyway, see you later."
Em: Oh, but yeah, it's, it's our...
Christine: And that stork was duct taped to my, duct-taped to my wall for like a year. It was cool.
Em: Well, hey, you know what? Speak... You know what? You're welcome, because you're bringing it up during our birthday episode, which is exactly what a stork would want. Of all the episodes, he would want to be mentioned on this one. So you're welcome?
Christine: Right, he did bring us to our parents' house.
Em: Yeah, that's what they say. Um, happy birthday, Christine. What do you want for your birthday?
Christine: Aw, I want a cool background on Em's video. [chuckle] Bummer. It was the only thing I'd wish for all year. Um, thank you, Em.
Em: What a shame.
Christine: Uh happy birthday to you as well. I guess in answer to your question, I would love something yummy to drink, which is great news, 'cause I brought my Strawberry Fanta with me today. Um.
Em: That's nice! Don't you want to wanna want a Fanta?
Christine: Don't you wanna? Now, what is your birthday wish, my friend?
Em: My birthday wish is to have a green screen background, but [chuckle] what I can probably get instead that's much more realistic is a million dollars, so, um.
Christine: [chuckle] What? Oh. I was like, "Wait, how?"
Em: Other...
Christine: Yeah, yeah, both impossible.
Em: Other than that, I would like... Hmm. I don't know because we're...
Christine: Mm, damn that's good.
Em: I haven't had the strawberry one.
Christine: It tastes like cough syrup, which you know I love. I mean, not to drink.
Em: Yeah.
Christine: But I love that gross, sweet flavor.
Em: Mmm.
Christine: Mmm. [chuckle]
Em: Uhh, you know what I want that I haven't had? I really haven't had one in a week and a half. A good nap.
Christine: Yeah. Oh, no nap in a week and a half? What happened?
Em: I got busy. I don't know. [chuckle] But I sure would like one.
Christine: It's gotta suck, man. I'm so sorry about that.
Em: I know. So some birthday Zs...
Christine: Oh, you know why...
Em: That's what I wanna catch.
Christine: You know why I drank this week?
Em: Why?
Christine: 'Cause I have to take Leona to soccer practise today, help me.
Em: Your eye literally twitched when you said it.
[laughter]
Christine: That's how you know I'm in real trouble. It's actually the last one of the season, thank God. I don't... I signed her up for this. Like, I'm happy she's doing it. I just didn't think I'd be responsible for attending, um...
Em: Isn't that fun?
Christine: Yeah. No, uh no.
Em: So what, what is it... Okay, this is me coming to you as someone who obviously has no children. I only know being a parent at the kids' soccer games from television. So...
Christine: Yeah, well, it's...
Em: What I think it looks like is slices of oranges magically appear. You have to do zero work. They just, they're always just there.
Christine: Yeah, this is way young. This is two year olds. They don't even speak barely, so this is like...
Em: They don't even eat oranges?
Christine: Not any sort of real soccer match. There's no like real... It's like 30 minutes, and they just run around and pretend the cones are dinosaurs, and then we go home.
Em: So what is the um, the ugh part to that, if it's only 30 minutes?
Christine: To leave...
Em: 'Cause in my mind it only gets worse.
Christine: Leave my house, is the first one.
Em: Oh, fair enough.
Christine: Drive anywhere is the second one. Be around other people is the third one. Um, I could keep going, but those are the...
Em: Decent, that's enough.
Christine: Those are the main, yeah. And it's like fine, but you know.
Em: At least it's...
Christine: Well, okay, it's fine. It's fine. And most of the parents are fine and nice, and it's... But everyone's just kinda awkwardly like hovering until it's over. And then we all just go home, and it's like, okay, this is fine.
Em: Well.
Christine: She loves it.
Em: Okay.
Christine: That's what matters.
Em: It will only get.
Christine: I tell myself.
Em: So if it makes it...
Christine: I know.
Em: You feel better. [chuckle]
Christine: And that's, that's what I'm saying. I'm like, what have I done? But I vow from now on to only sign her up for things during our recording schedule so that I don't have to participate.
[chuckle]
Em: How manipulative. But you know what, you have to do that in parenthood sometimes. Uhh, I'm fully supportive. Uh... And you know what?
Christine: You have to look up for number one, baby.
Em: And honestly, that... I don't even... I mean, it's... Is there such a thing as positive manipulation? Because, um, Blaise loves leaving the house, and he loves routine.
Christine: Yeah, he does.
Em: So you're kind of does doing him a favor.
Christine: He loves doing the work I don't wanna do, that's what I say all the time about him.
Em: You married the right guy.
Christine: I sure did.
Em: He's a good man, Christine.
Christine: He's a good one.
Em: Um.
Christine: He a... He does all the... I just babysit sometimes.
[laughter]
Em: You... [chuckle] You come up with, um...
Christine: Just kidding.
Em: You come up with all the good ideas and he...
Christine: That's right.
Em: He activates them? What's the right word? I don't know.
Christine: Uh.
Em: He...
Christine: Yeah, he activates them.
Em: Endures is probably a better word. Um...
Christine: He endorses them, yes. He does not endorse necessarily, but he does endure.
Em: Execute, that's the word I was thinking.
Christine: He executes them.
Em: Um, okay, well, I'm sorry you have to leave your house for 30 minutes. That sounds like a real birthday bummer, but...
Christine: Thank you so much. It's gonna be hard. Um, but you know what? I think, together, I'll get through it. And by together I mean me and Leona, side by side.
Em: Well, uh, is there any... Oh, and you're drinking your Fanta. I'm drinking some leftover water. Yuck. It tastes dusty.
Christine: What?
Em: I'm trying to...
Christine: There is such a, a taste for leftover water, and I feel like...
Em: Thank you.
Christine: It doesn't get discussed enough that it tastes dusty. And it's so true.
Em: I think it gets discussed quite a lot in...
Christine: Oh. [chuckle]
Em: Some very specific... No.
Christine: Oh.
Em: In some very specific circles. And then nowhere else because...
Christine: Well, let me in.
Em: Sometimes I...
Christine: 'Cause I have things to say about dusty water. [chuckle]
Em: Sometimes I say it and everyone in the circle is like, "Ugh, disgusting." And then other people are like, "What the fuck are you talking about?"
Christine: Like, what are you talking about? And I'm like, you clearly aren't paying enough attention to the world around you if you don't know what...
Em: Sounds like your tongue's broken if you can't feel this.
Christine: Yeah, or it sounds like you hydrate enough and clean up your dishes enough that you and I won't get along. So. [chuckle]
Em: Well also, you know how like a, like water in a plastic bottle like after like a day it tastes like plastic bottle?
Christine: Ugh, yep.
Em: Like pass. Um.
Christine: Yeah, especially when it's in the car, and then they're like... "Oh, and now you'll get cancer too."
Em: Oh.
Christine: And I'm like, cool. It's just a double win.
Em: Just kidding. Eight things I ate today are gonna be give me, gimme cancer, so...
Christine: [chuckle] I know, I'm like, as I eat strawberry Fanta. I can't believe I used to drink water.
Em: I throw...
[laughter]
Christine: Oh God.
Em: Yeah, I just am, I'm enduring some old water today. This doesn't feel like a good birthday taste-wise currently.
Christine: This is the saddest world. [laughter] You're sitting there with that hat on.
Em: Doesn't feel good.
Christine: It looks like all the lights are off in your room. You're just like in the dark. [laughter]
Em: You know what? I hate... By the way, I also hate how dark my room has to be, but...
Christine: Why is it so dark? Oh, your glasses?
Em: Well, it always has to be dark, because my glasses. That it, like... The brighter it is, the less you can see my eyes. [laughter] And obviously, these beauties are what everyone wants. [chuckle]
Christine: We don't want... Well, the problem is then I'm reflected back. If, if the light is brighter, then it's just me in your glasses.
Em: Yeah, that little white square is you.
Christine: That's me. Hi.
Em: Look, look. You're a twinkling my eye.
Christine: Oh, that... Oh, I look like a piece of dust that got in your eye. But yeah, I'll take it.
Em: No, all the dust is in my water, so. Um, so anyway, we're gonna move on to the next portion of our birthday tour.
Christine: Uh-oh, where's Emathy?
Em: No.
Christine: Oh.
Em: Did I freeze?
Christine: Hello? Yep, you're back. You're back. Yeah, I... After I said the dust in your eye, you went away for a while.
Em: Oh, I said, I said something woody back. I said, oh, the dust is all in my water, so there's nothing to worry about. Um.
[chuckle]
Christine: Ah.
Em: Whatever. It landed so good the second time. Okay so...
Christine: I thought it was funny.
[laughter]
Em: Ah, well, I have really no updates or anything to say. I just wanted to celebrate our birthday and celebrate...
Christine: Aww.
Em: You, Miss Christine, my favorite little lady. And so, um, by doing that, we're now gonna move to the second part of the now really like diluted surprise, since the backgrounds don't work. So I'm gonna just send you a picture of what you could see. You ready?
Christine: Oh, okay. I can't wait. Yeah, send me, send me.
Em: Well, well, the reason I didn't want to send you another picture, even though you kept pressing me...
Christine: You needed... I needed to have the surprise.
Em: You needed the surprise, because, um, this... Let me tell ya... Tell me when it comes through.
Christine: What is an AVIF file?
Em: Can you... Can you click it? Does it open?
Christine: Let me see. Oh my... Oh my God. Is this a wild west saloon?
Em: I got a story for you, Christine.
Christine: What's this? What's this? What's this? I wanna move there.
Em: For your birthday...
Christine: I wanna live there.
Em: We got ourselves... Hang on.
Christine: Oh! I didn't even see you in the hat. Wow. Whoa. Is that a bandana? What's happening?
Em: Costume change.
Christine: Ahh!
Em: Happy birthday.
Christine: My cowboy!
Em: From, from the ghosts at the OK Corral.
Christine: Ahhhhh! Ahhh!
Em: Okay.
[chuckle]
Christine: We gotta put this fucking thing in the background. Jack, help, help!
Em: Just know that I was supposed to be in the old wild west as I tell this story.
Christine: Oh, well you look the part if that's helpful.
Em: Thank you. This hat would also fit my head if I didn't also have headphones on underneath, so...
Christine: And guess what else?
Em: It's a lot of imagination going on here. What?
Christine: I bet you they had a lot of dusty water back then in the wild west.
Em: Yeah. I'm, I'm doing it in spirit, obviously. That was...
Christine: Yeah, you're like really method acting with that dusty old water.
Em: Thank you. In fact, this is...
Christine: Oh, Em, you look great. Look at that curly, curly hair under that cowboy hat.
Em: I know.
Christine: Just poofin' right up.
Em: I would've had alll the ladies. Okay, so...
Christine: Yeah, you would. [chuckle]
Em: All right. Are you ready for an okay time at the OK Corral, Christine?
Christine: I'm ready for an exuberant time at the OK Corral.
Em: I wish I had some little fake guns to go...
[vocalization]
Em: And put them in my pistols, in my, in my holsters.
Christine: Yeah. They didn't have those at Party City?
Em: No, I looked. [laughter]
Christine: For guns? [laughter] Right.
Em: I couldn't ask either. I was like, "Hey, do you have any fucking guns?"
Christine: "Do you have any guns?"
Em: At Party City. I'm trying to go for a real rootin' tootin' time.
[laughter]
Christine: What about water pistol though? Do like a little...
Em: Oh, well, I, I don't have time to go back now. Okay, so this is where we're at. Here is the OK Corral and the ghosts of Boothill Cemetery.
[vocalization]
Christine: I...
Em: Wait, that's not Western. [chuckle]
Christine: Delighted.
Em: What's the western sound?
Christine: What the fuck is that? That's fucking Transylvania.
[laughter]
Em: Okay, shot that.
Christine: That's vampire...
Em: You know, AI edit that into a Western, a spaghetti western sound. Okay. So...
Christine: Remember when I said spaghetti western, and you were like, "What are you saying, fetuccini?"
Em: I do.
Christine: What did you say? You said something very funny, like, "Oh, a lasagna?" Okay, nevermind. That wasn't what you said. [chuckle] What you said was actually funny.
Em: Landed. [laughter]
Christine: What you said... Hey, am I frozen? I made a good joke.
[laughter]
Em: Um, what did I say? I said...
Christine: I don't know.
Em: I'm something... I'm sure I...
Christine: Something stupid about pasta. Ooh, shoot.
Em: That sounds right.
Christine: I just knocked myself over.
Em: If there's... If there's one thing I know how to do, it is be stupid, and sometimes funny, but not often.
Christine: Discuss pasta also in, in tandem.
Em: Oh. I'm very good at that. Okay, let's get into this. I'm... And you know, I want you to know we're recording later or whenever we record next. I had a whole other set of notes that I planned on doing. Oh, girl. What's happening to your face?
Christine: Uh-oh. What is happening to my face? Oh...
Em: Let's see, you're the... [laughter]
Christine: Wow, what's happening? Oh, my gosh.
Em: Ave Maria... [laughter]
Christine: What if now is the rapture, and I'm just leaving? Bye. [laughter] How do I fix this? Oh no. It's just getting worse. Oh my God. Bye. Uh, hold on. Is it... Is it...
[laughter]
Em: For your birthday I got, I called a UFO. I had them... I, it's a one hour Uber service to get abducted.
Christine: Oh, cool. Um, they gotta fix their lighting though, 'cause it's not a good look.
Em: They beamed you up in real time.
Christine: Oh my gosh. Okay. Is that better? I can't tell anymore.
Em: It's better, it's better.
Christine: I can't tell what's like real anymore. Um.
Em: Whatever you're doing, stop. It's gonna...
Christine: My camera just decided it's gonna open up and change, change the, the hue and the saturation.
Em: That was crazy.
Christine: Anyway, that was crazy.
Em: Also, the fact that you would think, if... The rapture is a package deal, dude. If you make it into the rapture somehow, I will also be...
Christine: That's true. Like, there's no bar that I'm higher up than you. Yeah, we would be on the same level for sure.
Em: If somehow you're in, it's because we both ankle bit our way in. Um.
Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah. We accidentally, we hitched a ride on somebody else. Probably Eva, [laughter] just grabbed one of her feet. Ah.
[laughter]
Em: Okay. So... And by the way, I don't know much about the rapture, but UFO abductions sound similar to me.
Christine: Yeah, very similar.
Em: So, if God is real...
Christine: It sounds fun.
Em: I think she's an alien, and heaven is the mothership. You know what saying?
Christine: Her name is Xenon, and we worship her.
[laughter]
Em: Can you imagine if she's in control of everything? That would actually make a lot of sense why so much is on fire.
Christine: She's in charge of the rapture. Yeah.
[laughter]
Christine: She keeps pressing the wrong button.
Em: She just pulled the lever too far.
Christine: Yeah. Yes. That actually explains a lot.
Em: It's 'cause she bends over to pick up her frappuccino that fell in the car, and she just leaned into the lever.
Christine: Oh, shit. And she leaned into the wrong lever. It happens to the best of us, girl. Don't worry, Xenon.
Em: Um, okay, I'll try to get to this now, 'cause I'm sure everyone's like boyfriends who are, who's forced listening to this in the car is like, "Get to the fucking point." So here we go.
Christine: They are like please stop explaining... Try it... To their partner, like, "Stop trying to explain to me who Xenon is. I don't, I didn't ask, and I don't wanna know." [laughter]
Em: I'm just listening to this...
Christine: And you know what? You're losing out.
Em: I'm just listening to this so after this episode I could pitch something you also hate. Yeah.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: It's fine.
Christine: Love that. Love that.
Em: Here we go.
Christine: I'd love to be recorded before Joe... Be played before Joe Rogan. That makes me very happy. I'm the pre... Predecessor.
Em: If we're played within 24 hours of Joe Rogan, it's because you are in a relationship with somebody else.
[laughter]
Christine: It's because Xenon accidentally hit the wrong lever, and we've just entered into a really bad timeline. Yeah.
Em: All right.
[vocalization]
Em: No, that's still Transylvania. Okay.
Christine: Mm-Hmm.
Em: We're in the 1880s.
Christine: Beautiful.
Em: And we're in very appropriately named Tombstone, Arizona.
Christine: Mm. Why do I think of Zak Bagans when I hear Tombstone?
Em: Because he has been to Tombstone, Arizona.
Christine: Okay. We must have watched that together.
Em: He does not... He does not make a guest feature in this, because some of the locations... It was, it was not worth it. It was not worth it. But had I covered a few more locations, this would've made sense.
Christine: I think I remember him wearing the cowboy outfit. That must, it must have stuck in my subconscious, unfortunately.
Em: That's the one.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Uh, cowboy Zak was, has been to Tombstone, Arizona.
Christine: Just hit a little note in my brain, unfortunately. I have to admit that.
[laughter]
Em: Uh, spring of the year. [laughter] Okay, so...
Christine: Roses, roses.
[chuckle]
Em: So yes, the gunfight at the OK Corral is, fun fact, the most famous fight in film history.
Christine: Oh.
Em: And the way it has that record is because it is the most filmed, uh, event.
Christine: Smart.
Em: In, in terms of gunfights. It has been featured in nearly 50 movies, and, uh, the two most famous are Gunfight at the OK Corral in 1957 and Tombstone in 1993. Another fun fact, do you know what the OK of the OK Corral stands for?
Christine: Oklahoma? I have no idea.
Em: Okay. I always thought the OK Corral was in Oklahoma...
Christine: Me too.
Em: Because of OK [laughter] Hey, are, as you heard Arizona, did you go uh-oh?
Christine: Yeah. [laughter] I went... You're like, "We're going to", and I was like, "Say it with me... Nevermind. Not gonna speak."
[chuckle]
Em: Uh, I should have... I should have played one up on you...
Christine: You should've guessed. Yeah.
Em: And said, "Say it with me", and said Oklahoma with you just to make you feel good and then rip it out from you.
Christine: That's so mean. [chuckle]
Em: OK stands for Old Kindersley.
Christine: Oh, I never would've known that. Nope.
Em: The Old Kindersley Corral. And uh, another fun fact, the gunfight itself did not actually happen at the OK Corral, but near the Corral. And I guess because it was like the nearest monument, that's how it got its title.
Christine: Mmm, And it's catchy.
Em: It is catchy. Across, across the all generations. You hear the OK Corral...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: You go, "Ooh, something not so okay happened there." Um.
Christine: Yeah. It really has like a beautiful paradox in the name. Yeah.
Em: Yeah. [chuckle] So I did not... And by the way, if you're like a western fan, and like you know, you're like a big fan of these characters, I'm telling you now this is not the episode to get like super jazzed for, because I could have deep dove into all of these people and it would've... There's a lot of information on like Wyatt Earp. Like, that was gonna take too fucking long.
Christine: [chuckle] This is not the Wyatt Earp podcast quite yet. I've been fighting for it for years, but one day. One day, I'll wear Em down, but not yet.
Em: I just... There was a lot of, uh, famous names here, and like I... It's like if you wanted me to like... If I was talking about Frank Sinatra, and I had a deep dive on Frank Sinatra, it would've become a Frank Sinatra episode. So we're not doing that. But just to give you the names...
Christine: I got, I got that.
Em: We... Here's the good side, and then I'll just give you the bad side. 'Cause I never knew who was right and wrong in this. Um...
Christine: Oh, the good... Like the good guys and the bad guys?
Em: Yeah, yeah.
Christine: Okay.
Em: So the good guys are Doc Holliday, which is a name I have definitely heard of throughout the years.
Christine: Mmhmm, Mmhmm.
Em: And then three of the five Earp brothers. I always thought Wyatt Earp was it. I didn't know he even had siblings. I assume cowboys just run away at five years old and become like vigilante cowboys and like have nobody.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Let alone...
Christine: I mean, I think that is a lot of the time actually how it does work, or did work, but the Earp brothers...
Em: Well, the fact that he's got a bunch of siblings, and they're all cow, or they're all from the wild west is crazy. So Doc Holliday and then three of the five Earp brothers. I will say, fun fact, the names of all five brothers are Wyatt, Morgan, Virgil, James, and Warren.
Christine: Okay.
Em: James and Warren are not part of the picture. We don't ever have to remember those names ever again.
Christine: Goodbye.
Em: So it's Doc Holliday, and then Wyatt, Morgan, and Virgil, uh, Earp.
Christine: Virgil Earp is a terrible name. I'm sorry. [chuckle] Like Virgil Earp...
Em: It sounds like a burp.
Christine: Just sounds like... It sounds like a bad beverage that got like shelved for one minute and then was like nevermind.
Em: It sounds like Dr. Pepper's actual name.
Christine: Have a sip of Virgil Earp.
Em: And then they were like, you need a stage name actually.
Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's your birth name. You need a better one. Virgil Earp is not gonna work.
Em: Yeah, it sounds like your tummy after you have too much like red sauce.
[vocalization]
Christine: Yes, it does. I have IBS. That's what it sounds like. [chuckle] That's what IBS sounds... That's a sound of IBS, I think, Virgil Earp.
Em: Yeah, Virgil Earp is just the onomatopoeia of like bubble gut. So. [chuckle]
Christine: Oof, yeah. Sorry Virgil, but it was just never cut out for you, you know?
Em: I feel like he would introduce himself to the ladies, and they'd be like, "What did you say your name was? There's no way. Was that a joke? Did you come over here on a bet?"
Christine: Hey, Eddie, come here. This guy, you gotta hear him. He says his name's Virgil Earp. [chuckle]
Em: Thank, thank God he had other brothers, 'cause you know he probably used their names instead sometimes. He's like, "My name's James."
Christine: Yeah. It's like, no, I'm the real James. Wyatt? I can take that one.
Em: Well, Virgil Earp is actually the most... I think if you were like a cowboy aficionado... Please don't attack me, I'm coming from a very 101 standpoint of this. But at least in this story, Virgil Earp holds the most power. And it's interesting that Wyatt Earp is so famously known with this story, because his brother Virgil is arguably the main character.
Christine: It's the name.
Em: It's got to be. Even Virgil was like, "I don't know, Wyatt. Just take the reins. I can't, I can't stand much, hearing my own fucking name."
Christine: Just give it to Wyatt. [chuckle]
Em: So, okay, the Earp brothers and Doc Holliday, good side. Bad side are the Cochise County Cowboys.
Christine: Oh!
Em: Also known as The Cowboys. And apparently...
Christine: The Cowboys.
Em: They're the cowboys that made the word cowboy offensive to real cowboys.
Christine: Oh.
Em: So apparently you could, after this, insult cowboys by calling them cowboys, and they'd take offence because of the Cochise County Cowboys.
Christine: Oh. They're like, "We're not one of those guys."
Em: Yeah. It's like, "Whoa. They put a bad rep on our whole name, our whole thing."
Christine: Oh, I see. I see, okay.
Em: So, of the Cochise County Cowboys, there's a few of them, but the ones we care about are the McClaury brothers, the Clanton brothers, and Billy Claiborne. There's five people in total, two McClaury brothers, two Clanton Brothers, and Billy Claiborne. Um, so if that's too many names for you, just remember if they're not an Earp or Doc Holliday, they're bad.
Christine: Boo.
Em: So that's the only way I could go through it. I was like, this is too many... This is like learning the Duggers all at once. I can't do it. [chuckle] So...
Christine: That requires like special dedicated interest that spans years, you know, to learn all that and memorize it.
Em: Yeah. Someone who's like actually lives in the wild west and studied this is like, "Oh my God, this is like the fucking easiest thing you could possibly know."
Christine: These people.
Em: So, before this day, tensions were already really rough between the Earp brothers and the Cowboys; especially the Clantons. Out of all those... Out of that whole chunk of people, the Clanton brothers hated them especially. And, uh, this is because... Well historically, I guess, cowboys and lawmen, as they say, um, they obviously didn't like each other for a few reasons. Uh, cowboys... Most cowboys were good, but the cowboys that were bad are who the lawmen were after. And so it just became this like association that the lawmen hate the cowboys and the cowboys hate the lawmen.
Christine: Right, right, right.
Em: On top of that, one of the reasons that there was originally a wedge is because many ranchers and cowboys at the time originally fought for the Confederacy.
Christine: Oh.
Em: Whereas the businessmen and lawmen had fought for the Union.
Christine: I see.
Em: So immediately they politically don't agree with each other. On top of that, uh, on top of both having fought in the Confederacy, ranchers and cowboys, they worked so closely together, both in war, but also they... Because they trusted each other after the war, they would conspire with each other and often in nefarious ways.
Christine: Mmm.
Em: So, for Tombstone specifically, a lot of their, a lot of the people who immigrated in... I guess there was silver mines over there, and a lot of people started coming in. And it happened to be a bunch of groups of people where they all relied heavily on meat in their diets.
Christine: Okay.
Em: Which I feel like isn't that surprising, but it, it worked out very well because they moved to an area where cattle was high demand. Um, and now as more people are coming in and more meat is being put into people's diets, there's an even higher demand for cattle, but ranchers are trying to save money wherever they can. So they started conspiring with outlaw cowboys to steal cattle...
Christine: Ohhh.
Em: From other places to bring it in.
Christine: Oh.
Em: So they would basically have more cattle under the table.
Christine: That's shady.
Em: Um, they also... Because they were so close to Mexico, they would also hire cowboys to smuggle in cattle from across the border.
Christine: Vaqueros.
Em: Yep. What'd you say?
Christine: Sorry, that was... [laughter] Vaqueros. I think that was the word that I learned when I did, uh, Billy the Kid, um. It's, it's the, the word that was often used for Mexican cowboys, vaqueros.
Em: Oh, if you already taught me that, I'm glad I got to learn it twice.
Christine: I did. But like, it's one of those things that I would never expect you to remember. I just remember because I did the notes and was so like invested in it. But yeah, vaquero, yeah. They, they did a lot of, um, early work before cowboy, the word cowboy, really came into, into play.
Em: Sure. Well, so, these ranchers and these cowboys ended up kind of being, you know, in an alliance with each other to, you know, evade the lawmen who would arrest them for their, their illegal matters. So, basically, the ranchers and cowboys were already tight for both being Confederates versus the lawmen who were Union. But plus their new darker alliances, it, it just forced an even bigger wedge between them and trusting the lawmen, which meant that the lawman would stereotype cowboys and not trust them. So, now that's like the... And I'm sure there are more elements. Please don't tap me.
Christine: Nope. That's it.
Em: But that's, that's the ones I found...
Christine: Think that's it.
Em: As of like two or three days ago. Umm, on top of all that, the Cochise County Cowboys in in particular had, uh, a hatred for the Earps, because at some point they, uh, got into a fight with the Earp brothers that ended with, umm... I just wanna keep all the names straight. The two sets of brothers that I'm talking about, and the, and the Cowboys, the McLaurys and the Clantons, they were in an alliance smuggling goods in, uh, and Mexican forces were like, "Stop stealing our shit." And I guess at some point the Earp brothers got involved and they made an alliance with the Mexican forces to battle or...
Christine: Oh, to defend...
Em: Get rid of the Cla... To help them. Yeah. And so they were like...
Christine: Their... I see.
Em: "We already don't like the Clantons and the McLaurys. We'll help you out."
Christine: I see.
Em: Somehow in this kerfuffle, it happened that one of the Clantons' fathers was killed by an Earp.
Christine: Uh-Oh.
Em: And so now they really hate the Earps because their dad was killed by one of them.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: So ever since then, the Cochise County Cowboys would, were regularly threatening the Earps, like saying like, "If We ever see you... "
Christine: May I ask, like, How do you spell that? Like co coach, Cochi? Co?
Em: C... C-O-C-H-I-S-E.
Christine: I-S. Cochise. Oh, ho. Okay. I thought you were saying like cheese.
Em: Can you imagine?
Christine: I was getting... Yeah. 'cause that's what I've been thinking about.
Em: The che, the cheesy cowboys. That'd be amazing.
Christine: That's the last 20 minutes. Umm, okay. Gotcha. Cochise. Cochise.
Em: Umm, and so yeah, the, the Cowboys now officially really, really hate the Earps. They are ready to kill on site. And Tombstone around this time... This was 1881. Tombstone passed an ordinance banning weapons from town, like from all town. They said this is a weapon free zone.
Christine: Woah.
Em: If you wanna come into our town, you have to check your weapons at the door by the... There's like stables by the entrance to our town.
Christine: By the swinging door to the saloon.
[chuckle]
Em: You have to leave them at...
Christine: Oh my God. Your thumbs up just showed up. [laughter] Not again.
Em: I wish there was... Oh, someone said I have to try the... This guy. Oh wait.
Christine: Someone, someone's fucking with you.
Em: Someone said I have to do... This is I love you, but someone said I do the rock and roll thing. Maybe I need to clear it out. Hang on. Rock and roll brother.
Christine: Maybe it's too distracted by your hat.
Em: Maybe. Shit.
Christine: But what, did we figure out what it is? Like, is it Riverside or is it your computer?
Em: It's, It's apparently an, an Apple update.
Christine: Oh. Well, I guess I better update my computer, 'cause nothing happens when I do it. Rock and roll, baby.
Em: Yeah. Like, I don't know why it's not working now. Someone said to do that. Someone else said peace. But didn't we do peace last time?
Christine: We did peace. Yeah.
Em: There it is, balloons.
Christine: It was balloons.
Em: Oh, Happy Birthday.
Em: Oh wait. Fuck. Oh, I can't do it. Sorry, Em. [chuckle] I do it in spirit. If you wanna know, Em, how I feel about you, it's lots of these hearts, lots of balloons.
Em: Oh, you mean this?
Christine: Yeah. Stop showing off. They go through your hands. It's so cool. I think Eva...
Em: And not this?
Christine: I think Eva was gone when we did this, wasn't she? So she missed... She's like, what's fuck, what the fuck is going on?
Em: It became an entire segment. It was crazy. Umm.
Christine: It Was crazy.
[chuckle]
Em: It was nanners as the cowboys said back in the day. Umm.
Christine: This, this kerfuffle was nanners, as they always said.
Em: So, uh, okay, so now Tombstone says, "If you wanna come to our town, there's stables nearby." Or is it livery? Livery? Livery.
Christine: Livery, livery.
Em: Really? Oh.
Christine: Yeah.
Christine: I would've been saying that wrong the whole time. Umm, "You gotta leave your weapons there. You can get them when you leave, but this is a weapon free zone. Don't bring your shit in this place." And I, like how bad must the wild, the west, have been that the town had to be like, "Please don't hurt anybody when you're here"?
Christine: Just Like plea... And it's like, don't... Even if you think you're not gonna hurt somebody, you probably will. So please don't bring your gun. It's like...
Em: We don't wanna find out.
Christine: You don't even... You can't trust yourself anymore in this town.
Em: Exactly. So, uh, to make sure people were honoring this new rule, the Earps, because... I forgot to mention this earlier. Umm, but remember I said Virgil Earp is like the most powerful of the Earp brothers in this story. He's the town Marshall, and he's the deputy US Marshal.
Christine: Oh shit. Oh, okay.
Em: So he's like, like he's making the rules.
Christine: Big time.
Em: And he was patrolling the grounds now to make sure that everyone in fact did not have weapons on them when they were in Tombstone, Arizona. So if he finds people with them, he confiscates them. Umm, and these pissed off cowboys heard about this ordinance of like don't bring your weapons in, and they did not like being challenged like that. So they roll up, obviously without dropping their weapons off at the entrance. And the Earps see that two of these cowboys, the... One of the Clanton brothers and then the guy Billy Claiborne, they, they see that these guys have their guns, and uh, they end up getting them. So now these two of the Cowboys are unarmed. But they hear through town that the other Cowboys in their group are like just waiting to be told to give up their guns...
Christine: Uh-oh.
Em: So they can lift them and essentially bang, bang. Umm, and so... And it's also been caught through town... I guess people are, through the game of telephone, saying like, "I saw the Cowboys over here. They're def... They definitely have weapons on them. I saw this one like putting a bunch of bullets into, into, into their guns." Like, "I heard this one threatening that they were gonna shoot Virgil the second they see him."
Christine: Ah.
Em: So people are running and telling the sheriff about this. Some of them even find Virgil himself and say like, "Don't go near him." The sheriff even finds Virgil and says, "Do not go near them. They're... " He... I think he was quoted saying, "Don't go down there. They will murder you."
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Virgil apparently tells the sheriff, this is a quote, "Those men have made their threats, and I will not arrest them. I will kill them on site."
Christine: Ah. Oh, oh.
Em: He said, he said, "Hold my hoops. I'm gonna fuck them up."
[laughter]
Em: And so...
Christine: I was like, "Hold my gun. Wait, don't hold my gun. I need that."
Em: Yeah. He's like, I know we said no guns, but actually I need my gun.
Christine: That's different...
Em: So I'm gonna carry that into Tombstone.
Christine: It's different.
Em: So the Earps, uh, at least Virgil and Wyatt, umm, just the two of them at first, they are like, "Okay, we're gonna go find these people. 'Cause if they're... If their plan is to shoot us, we almost have to go find them so we can shoot them first." Umm, and so they were like, "But just in case, let's bring some back up." So they ask their brother, Morgan, to come with them. Morgan sounds like a rough and tumble kind of guy. He's like, "Let me get my shoes on. I'm coming."
Christine: Switch. I'm already ready to go.
Em: Yeah. And also, what does that say about James and Warren? Like where, what were they up to?
Christine: They're pretty smart. They're like, "Fuck this. I'm doing my homework."
Em: Yeah, I wonder, like did... Could you... You couldn't call them. So like, was like Morgan just the unlucky brother who was walking by, and they were like, "You have to help us shoot somebody." Like what?
Christine: Yeah. And then the other one was just like in the outhouse by, you know, he had...
Em: He overheard and just stayed a little longer.
Christine: He had a case of Virgil Earp, and he had to be in the outhouse for longer than usual. [laughter] So they were like, oh, bummer. He is Virgil Earp.
Em: Umm, so, uh, yeah. So they say, "Morgan, you gotta help us." And he says, "Okay, bro code. I'm on my way. And I'm bringing my friend, Doc holiday"
Christine: Bro code. [chuckle]
Em: "By the way, like, don't even worry about it. I'm bringing my friend, Doc, because he's like a badass and he's gonna get the job done. But maybe steer clear because he does have tuberculosis, and it's active at the moment."
Christine: Are you serious?
Em: Which like, talk about a fucking homie. This guy had tuberculosis and got out of his bed to go fucking kill somebody. So...
Christine: He is like, hold my bloody handkerchief. [laughter] I got places to be.
Em: I guess he was like, I don't have much time left. I might as well have one last hoorah. Umm, so...
Christine: Yeah, I guess so.
Em: And I saw one source say that Doc Holliday only came because he wanted to be in the dry desert, like the dry air, because it would help with his tuberculosis.
Christine: Right.
Em: But I can't belie... One, dusty desert can't be good for your lungs. And two, it's not like he had three days to travel to Arizona to do this. Like this was the day of...
Christine: Yeah. It seems like he was already there.
Em: I think he was already there. Maybe he was already there for the dry air.
Christine: For the...
Em: And he was like, when in Rome I might as well shoot them up.
Christine: This is what they do here. Yeah.
Em: Yeah. I'm, I'm with the culture now. Maybe, I don't know. He's Doc Holliday. He has done this before.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Umm. [laughter] But yeah, he has active tuberculosis.
Christine: Geez.
Em: Which like, also I, as a Earp brother, would almost be like, ooh, I actually don't really need him that badly. Like...
[laughter]
Christine: Yeah, I'm okay. Maybe he can stand really far away.
Em: If I was gonna go get into like a street fight, and someone said, "Oh, my friend's coming, but he has COVID", I'd be like, Ugh, actually he doesn't have to come.
Christine: Yeah, ugh.
Em: You know?
Christine: I love that you were like planning your street fight. You're like, it's not that kind of street fight, actually. We don't wanna spread germs. We're actually being really conscientious. But I'm gonna go punch somebody.
[laughter]
Em: If you had to get into a street fight right now, like you get to call any of your friends, obviously Renee is invited.
Christine: Sure, she's already there.
Em: Umm, she's, she's obviously coming. [laughter] Umm, she's probably caused it, to be honest.
Christine: I was gonna say, she's the one I'm fighting, I think.
[laughter]
Em: If, if you get to be in a street... If you get to be in a street fight, like you auditioned for it.
Christine: Yeah. Wow. Look at you in your bandana saying "get to be in a street fight" with jazz hands.
Em: Uh, if you... Okay, you have to be in a street fight. You pick three people you know. Who, who's, who are you asking to help you out? Who are your, who are your three Earp brothers to help you out?
Christine: Blaise, jujitsu. Renee, Aries, scary Aries.
Em: Renee period. [laughter]
Christine: Renee, period. Uh, who's the third? Umm. I don't know. Who would you call?
Em: I don't know. It would not be you. And for me I hope...
Christine: Yeah, no offense.
Em: That, no happily...
Christine: I also don't wanna be invited.
Em: I'm James with the bubble guts in the outhouse waiting to like not be picked.
[laughter]
Em: Umm, umm, it would definitely...
Christine: I'm gonna invite everybody to the street fight and then get Virgil Earp and hide away while they, while I handle it. That's my method.
Em: I would pick, umm, Deirdre.
Christine: Sure, sure, sure.
Em: I think I would call Renee.
[laughter]
Christine: I was gonna say, I might call Deirdre. Maybe... Maybe we just have our own little team.
[laughter]
Em: Umm, uh, just because he is the most backwards motherfucker I've ever met, probably my actual dad.
[laughter]
Christine: Wow. That's a twist.
Em: If we're getting, if we're getting the job done, you know. I'd that'd be the...
Christine: Then you could bring Linda, and there would be there a miniature... There would be a street fight within a street fight.
Em: Oh yeah. No, no, I don't... We don't need like an actual shootout to happen.
[laughter]
Christine: An act... Yeah. That would be way too violent.
[laughter]
Em: Umm, no. I think if I would call my dad and be like, "Hey, it's been 30 years since I asked for a favor, but, umm, uh, I'm gonna need you to knock the lights out of someone." And I think he'd do it. So...
Christine: I think he'd do it.
Em: I think if anyone asked him to, he'd do it.
[laughter]
Christine: Yeah.
Em: He'd be like, you got it.
Christine: I don't think... Yeah, he's ready.
Em: Umm, I think those would be my three.
Christine: He's the Morgan... He's the Morgan Earp of the situation.
Em: He absolutely... He's like, let me get my shoes on. I've been waiting guys.
Christine: I'm ready. Yeah.
Em: I've had some pent up stuff these days. I'm ready to just take it out on someone.
Christine: Just like let me swing.
Em: Umm, I do think I would... You would be my first call afterwards, though, to gossip about it.
Christine: Oh, I was gonna say, I would call you to make sure you were like monitoring the situation and like taking note for later storytelling and, you know, all that.
Em: Yeah. I think, uh, I would have to...
Christine: I'd need your documentarian prowess.
Em: You would be my Morgan Earp as in I'm gonna need you to dim the lights, heat up the popcorn, get me a cozy blanket. I'm coming over and we are gonna...
Christine: Oh.
Em: Wreck the...
Christine: We are gonna...
Em: The way this conversation's about to take every twist and turn there's ever been.
Christine: Oh, for sure. I've got everybody who was involved in the street fight, I've got their linked LinkedIn pages already up for analysis. [laughter] Like I'm ready to go.
Em: You've got the red string and the bulletin board.
Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm just, I'm like... I'm a wine... A box of wine on my lap, let's do it.
Em: Halfway through, we'll actually like, through Instagram, find one of their sisters and think like, "Oh my God, she's so cute. She'd be so fun to hang out with."
Christine: Oh my God.
Em: And then we like accidentally make a friend.
Christine: And then we'd be like, "Oh wow, this is such a conflict of interest, ha ha. [laughter] This is a good sitcom."
Em: Yeah, that's exactly how it would go.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: So anyway, they're all about to square up, Doc Holliday with his big fat cough, and, uh, the Earp brothers are coming down. They're all looking for these cowboys now, because they know that these cowboys are looking for them. They find out that the cowboys are heading towards the OK Corral. And they catch up to them there in an alley west of the corral, fun fact. Umm, and even the cowboys that they've already unarmed... Remember they got, they took some of their guns away? Even they show up. I wonder if it was like to warn the others of like, "Oh, they got my guns. Like, we're, we're now only three out of five."
Christine: It's time. Yeah.
Em: Umm, but they caught up with them. So now it's five against five. It's the Cowboys versus... Or no, four against five, 'cause it's the three Earp brothers and Doc Holliday versus the Cowboys. It's said that, uh, Virgil, Mr. Marshall, he said, "I'm going to like give you to the count of three, give me all your weapons", as he's holding them at gunpoint. Umm, and we don't know who actually shot first. All witnesses say that as soon as the shooting began, there was no way to tell who did it first. There was just a cloud of dust.
Christine: Wow.
Em: And 30 seconds later, the dust settled, and everyone was on the ground. They did not see anything until the dust cleared. They just heard bang, bang, bang.
Christine: Oh geez.
Em: In fact, they heard, I guess 30 shots within 30 seconds. And, uh, somehow the two who were unarmed, I think they could tell that it was go time and they did not have their guns. So they fucking bail. They book it out of there. That's you and me. We're like, "Wait a minute.:
Christine: Oh, yeah. Fuck this.
Em: "I thought this was a joke."
[laughter]
Christine: We didn't realize this was a real street fight.
Em: Yeah, it's like, actually, umm, if the only weapon I have are my hands, we have to leave. Umm.
Christine: Yeah. My finger hurts right now. I don't want to do anything.
Em: I got a paper cut earlier. It's a little crazy.
Christine: Yeah. [chuckle]
Em: So Ike and Billy, they... Ike and Billy Claiborne, they flee.
Christine: Skedaddle.
Em: Everyone else start shooting. And after those 30 seconds, uh, when the dust settles, Virgil has been shot through the calf. So he was able to survive.
Christine: Ow.
Em: Doc was grazed on the hip. I also heard that he was actually just bruised on the hip because a bullet hit his like holster and it ricocheted off of his hip. Umm, Wyatt Earp...
Christine: Think about all that dust, though, in that, in those fragile lungs.
Em: Well, think about having an open wound and all that dust in it.
Christine: That's gross.
Em: This is where my dad would come in. He'd be like, "Ah, just rub some dirt in it", and duct tape it up. That's...
Christine: Yeah, that's the how we'd used to do it in the old days.
Em: His dad used to like glue his skin back together if he ever cut it. Like I don't know what...
Christine: Yeah. My stepdad does that. He uses super glue.
Em: Who do I come from?
Christine: He's super glued my finger together. It works really well. My boys had...
Em: My dad did that to me too. He super glued my thumb together one time and I was like...
Christine: Well, he's had me do that recently. I think it's actually a thing.
[laughter]
Em: It sounds a little too Virginia for my California ass. Umm.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Now, I'm like...
Christine: It's not the best.
Em: Bandaid. We could just bandaid it, like... [laughter]
Christine: Well, sometimes you need a little more than bandaid. You know?
Em: I... Well, all right. It worked. I still have my thumb, so that... My dad would be like, did you die?
Christine: Oh, Eva says that's a thing. I used to do that in the bakery. See, it's a, it's a pretty common thing. I think. Umm...
Em: Okay.
Christine: The dirt in the wound, I would not recommend, and I don't think Blaise would recommend that either. Just saying.
Em: Uh, well, these people all have dirt in their wounds except for Wyatt Earp, which I think is why he's the most famous person to come out of this event because he somehow dodged all 30 bullets, and he was unharmed.
Christine: Wow.
Em: However, all the Cowboys that were left there died.
Christine: And there were, what, three left?
Em: It was Billy Clanton and... Three left. Billy Clanton. Uh, there was... I, I kept saying their last names, because there's two Billys. One of them was the unarmed one that fled, and the other one was one of the Clanton brothers.
Christine: Okay.
Em: Umm, Billy Clanton and the two McLaury brothers, they were the ones who stayed...
Christine: I see.
Em: And did the fight. Both, all three of them are dead.
Christine: I see, okay.
Em: The local paper refers to it as three men hurled into eternity in the duration of a moment.
Christine: Hurled into eternity in the duration of a moment.
Em: That's what happened to you earlier with your white background.
Christine: That's poetry. Yeah, that's right. I was, I was rising up into eternity in a mere moment.
Em: Hurled into eternity.
Christine: Wow.
Em: Uh, umm, the three that did die, the three Cowboys that died, they are all now buried in Boothill Cemetery. Remember this, 'cause we're gonna get back to Boothill Cemetery.
Christine: Boothill.
Em: The other Earp brothers later killed more of the Cowboys and ultimately escaped into New Mexico. And ironically, the OK Corral is now heavily associated, like I said, with Wyatt Earp, even though Virgil was more or so the prominent character. So today, the OK Corral is actually a replica of the original 1880 corral because it burned down.
Christine: Oh.
Em: But it now operates as a museum. And Christine, wouldn't you be so excited to know that they host daily gunfight at the OK Corral reenactments.
Christine: I would die. Uh, well, not literally. Sorry, that's wrong turn of phrase. I would be so [laughter] ecstatic.
Em: I would be shot in the calf and covered in dust.
Christine: I would dodge 30 fucking bullets. You watch me. [laughter] Yeah, right.
Em: Christine. Christine, my birthday girl, you are just the funniest person I've ever met.
Christine: Oh, stop it. You're saying that 'cause it's my birthday.
Em: The chuckles are so insane with you. I... Alison, Alison often tells me, when she is home, she's like, "I'm in the middle of like really important meetings and all of a sudden I just hear... "
[vocalization]
Christine: Ah, just shrieking.
[laughter]
Em: Okay. So that's the story of the official gunfight at the OK Corral. But did you know there was another gunfight at the OK Corral?
Christine: Oh no, I did not. There's a junior, a second, A 2.0?
Em: A 2.0. It was not so much a gunfight as a just shooting, umm, but it, it just wasn't as famous 'cause I guess the Earp brothers weren't there, or Doc Holliday. But in 1897, which was about 16 years after the gun fight at OK Corral, a gunfight happened between Justice Jim, Justice Jim Burnett, and William Green.
Christine: Okay. Willy Green.
Em: And Justice Jim was the justice of the piece. He was also a judge, and he was also a marshall. I don't know what's going on with the marshalls at Tombstone. Umm, seems like everyone has that on their resume.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Umm, so he was justice of the peace, a judge, and a marshall for the town nearby, but I guess he was just hanging out in Tombstone. He was also known to track down and fine outlaws. And one guy Justice Jim was always after was this guy William Green.
Christine: Okay.
Em: Some say that they were fighting over like water rights. I think they shared like a river in between their properties. Umm, and so they were like always like duking it out about like how the water should be used. Umm, William Green decided that he was going to fuck up Justice Jim's water supply by putting a dam in it.
Christine: Oh. Well that's not very nice.
Em: And uh, either way, William ended up building this dam, fucks up Jim's water situation, and a few days later William's daughters and their friend go swimming in the river. Umm, but one of his daughters and the friend end up drowning. Even though he was like, "That can't be, because I dammed up the water, it should be pretty shallow. How did this happen?" Umm.
Christine: Oh, no.
Em: And it's discovered later that, despite damming the water, someone else had gone in afterwards and used dynamite to blow up his dam causing insane rises in the water level. And so his daughters couldn't estimate how deep the water was, submerging them and killing them.
Christine: Oh my God.
Em: So Green, or William Green, he placed an ad for $1000 in 1897...
Christine: Wow.
Em: Yowza. Uh, he placed an ad for $1000 for anyone who had any information about who blew up his dam. He had a feeling it was Justice Jim, but he didn't have any evidence, so he needed someone else to tell him. He finds out that someone was paid by Justice Jim to blow up the dam. So in turn, William Green says, "You blew up my dam and killed my kids." Uh, and he found Justice Jim at the OK Corral pretty soon after, shoots him immediately three times, and kills Justice Jim.
Christine: Wow.
Em: So that is the other lesser story.
Christine: Mm-hmm. I didn't know that one.
Em: At the OK Corral. So the ghosts there are that... It's kind of like vague. I really thought I was gonna get some like really intense stories. Umm, but it seems that it's just a lot of apparitions of cowboys.
Christine: Oh. God. It's my dream.
Em: A lot of, a lot of this.
Christine: Oh, tip your hat. That's all I want.
Em: Umm, people see cowboys here all the time. A lot of times they're actually seen drawing guns. Yikes.
Christine: Oh. They don't want that part.
Em: No, no, no, no, no. Umm, and people see a tall man a lot of times wearing a hat who looks oddly like Virgil, Virgil Earp. Umm, people feel cold spots by the alley, which is where the event took place. People feel something touching and grabbing them. Visitors hear voices. They... Of course, this is where Christine's little shivers are gonna kick in. People hear spurred footsteps behind them.
[laughter]
Em: People also hear horses, uh, walking past them when nobody's around.
Christine: I was gonna ask if there's horse ghosties.
Em: There's little haunted ponies.
Christine: Aw.
Em: Umm, and people see shadows darting by all the time and feel presences literally walk through their bodies. Yuck.
Christine: I don't like that.
Em: Umm, tourists have also reported seeing apparitions fade in and out pacing outside of the corral. And they think it's the Cowboys waiting for Virgil and his brothers to show up.
Christine: Oh, 'cause that was probably such a high tension day, like moment, that they were probably so elevated.
Em: Yeah. Uh, tourists have... Oh yeah. Tourists have also seen the ghost of Justice Jim. Apparently he, of all the ghosts here, is like the most... One of the most well-known ghosts here is Justice Jim of all fucking people.
Christine: Alright.
[laughter]
Em: Probably because he's like, "Can people listen to my story too? What the hell's going on?"
Christine: Yeah. What about me?
Em: "Why do we not care about my story?" Umm, so he is seen a lot walking into a building. He's also seen walking through the streets near this area, which is so wild. But there's another story in, I think Dallas. I think it's the Miss Molly's Hotel. There's a, a cowboy ghost there that I've talked about, and I think his name's Cowboy Jake. Wow, it's all flooding back to me.
Christine: Yes. Cowboy Jake. I remember that.
Em: And Cowboy Jake was like known to... Like, 50% of the time he would haunt the hotel, and 50% of the time people would just see him walking past like all the main drags in town.
Christine: That's wild. And it's always wild to me when ghosts are like...
Em: Like window shopping.
Christine: In different... Window shopping. [chuckle] In different places. It just makes you really wonder like the nature of being a ghost, you know? Like how are you bopping around?
Em: I wish there was like Bumble BFF for ghosts, because if Justice Jim and Cowboy Jake could find each other, they could go walking together.
Christine: I mean, maybe there is, Em. Maybe there is, maybe they're already...
Em: It's called the ether. They already know.
Christine: They united. They're in the astral plane.
Em: That's a good point.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Umm, so Justice Jim's big. People also see him peering through windows, and then when he sees you notice him he shuts the windows really quick.
Christine: Bleh. Yuko.
Em: People describe him as balding with a beard and full of bullet holes.
Christine: He's full of bullet holes?
Em: Mmhmm.
Christine: Ah.
Em: Which is interesting, because I feel like he should only have three bullet holes, and like...
Christine: I mean, that's pretty full.
Em: The cow... And the Cowboys who had 30 bullets in 30 seconds should be...
Christine: They would be riddled. Yeah, yeah.
Em: Yeah. Umm, so I don't know, maybe people are getting their cowboys mixed up. I can't imagine they all... Especially like someone like me, who I don't know what any of them look like, I feel like...
Christine: Yeah, yeah.
Em: You just see a cowboy covered in bullet holes and you think, "Oh, that's the OK Corral," you know?
Christine: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it might be... Wow. Okay.
Em: Well, earlier I said that the three Cowboys killed at the OK Corral in the gunfight are now buried at Boothill Cemetery.
Christine: Yes.
Em: Which is also very, very haunted. So in 1878, Boothill Cemetery was founded, originally called very, very appropriately, Tombstone Cemetery.
Christine: Hey, I mean, come on.
Em: Like, come on.
Christine: I can't believe they changed that. That's ridiculous. That's ridiculous.
Em: Embarrassing. Embarrassing.
Christine: So embarrassing.
Em: Umm, and this was the only cemetery in town, so all the residents were there. But that meant all the good people and all the outlaws were all buried together. Umm, and in 1884 it closed when, also appropriately named, the New Cemetery was built.
Christine: [chuckle] Okay.
Em: These people just love making it easy. I love it.
Christine: Wow.
Em: Uh, the new New City Cemetery was built. Everyone wanted their loved ones buried there away from all the troublemakers throughout the town's history. In fact, so many residents felt this way that they even relocated their loved one's bodies from the old cemetery to the new cemetery.
Christine: You guys, like they're dead. I mean, underground, like they're dead. Okay. Whatever. I mean, listen, I guess if it's important to you, it's important to you. I shouldn't be so critical, but it's a little wild.
Em: People who, uh... People who did remain there though and were never moved were people such as Dutch Annie, aka, the Queen of the Red Light District of Tombstone, Arizona.
Christine: Ooh la la.
Em: And Sing Choi, aka The Godfather, even though she's a woman, because she was, uh, the general store owner, uh, in Tombstone. And she ran the town's opium den. Okay, Girl.
Christine: I see. Wow. So these are some high rollers, some uh, big names. Okay.
Em: Other people who have also remained there are the three Cowboys from the shooting at the OK Corral. So when the New Cemetery was built, Tombstone Cemetery was abandoned and nicknamed Boothill, because the only people left buried there were people who died with their boots on, aka they had died from violent deaths.
Christine: Oh, wow. Like a sudden death almost, like... Oh wow.
Em: Yeah.
Christine: Okay.
Em: So they were either shot or hanged or on the run or something like that.
Christine: Whoa.
Em: So it became nicknamed Boothill Cemetery since it was now the Outlaw Cemetery.
Christine: Oh, that's actually pretty like clever. I mean, not clever, that's not the right word, but like that's pretty creative?
Em: It is clever.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: It's dark, but it's clever.
Christine: Right.
Em: Umm, so there's two versions to this that I found. One is that in 1919 there was a reporter who went to Boothill, and, uh, because... Remember Boothill closed when the new cemetery opened. And so it had been closed at this point for almost like 40 years, I think.
Christine: Mm-hmm. Oh, wow. Okay.
Em: And a reporter went to go visit Boothill Cemetery and complained in the paper he wrote for how bad the condition was of the cemetery.
Christine: Mm-hmm.
Em: Another version is, in the 1920s, a guy went back to town after moving away and he wanted to visit his wife's grave, and he wrote to the paper about how bad the conditions were at the cemetery.
Christine: Okay.
Em: Either way, it was around the same time, kind of the same story. And by the 1930s, the town decided that they wanted to restore the grounds of Boothill Cemetery. And a lot of the work came from the help of the Boy Scouts.
Christine: Oh.
Em: They used it as a, a restoration project.
Christine: What kind of patch do you get, or pin do you get for that, I wonder?
Em: Like, I hope a shovel or something.
Christine: Just like... [chuckle]
Em: Like a, a grave...
Christine: Grave digger shovel. Yeah, that's, uh, you got my grave digging patch.
Em: You, you know if we were in the Boy Scouts, that would be the one patch we gave a shit about.
Christine: That's the only one I would get. I'd be like, I don't... Okay, I'm done. I quit.
Em: I would literally make my mom pay for the entire program of the Boy Scouts so I could earn that one.
Christine: Yep.
Em: And then I'd be like, I'm done. I quit.
Christine: And you know how pissed our parents, our moms, would be because like it... We'd have to like buy our own shovels, and I would want the shovel that all the other kids have. Like, you know what I mean? Like when you have to buy your own supplies.
Em: I'd be, I'd want the bedazzled one. [chuckle]
Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ours would be like all, like colored.
Em: Glow in the dark. Can you imagine a glow in the dark shovel?
Christine: Glow in the dark. Man.
Em: Why don't they make glow in the dark shovels? That feels like it would totally... Well, maybe 'cause a lot of dig, grave diggers would use them.
Christine: Well also, like maybe they do. I don't think that we are necessarily up on all our... They probably have them with lights, right? Like...
Em: Mmm, with lights.
Christine: I don't know about glow in the dark, but I imagine having a light on it would be really nice.
Em: Interesting. If there are any, uh, shovel aficionados...
Christine: Light-up shovel. Yeah. [laughter]
Em: Out there. Someone is.
Christine: Uh, oh...
Em: It's someone's special interest.
Christine: Glow in the dark shovel for WWE. [chuckle]
Em: Yes.
Christine: That's... Oh, it's compatible with all WWE action figures.
Em: Oh wait, it's a toy? [laughter] Fuck.
Christine: It's a toy.
Em: Shit. Okay, well, whatever. Okay. So unfortunately, as they were restoring this graveyard, umm, a lot of the original grave markers rotted away, because they were just wood, and...
Christine: Oh, sure.
Em: So many decades had passed, they were either rotten and decayed away, or people who knew this was like... Even back in the 1880s, people who had morbid curiosities... Or remember, this was the first wave of spiritualism.
Christine: Uh-huh.
Em: Uh, a lot of their grave markers were stolen, so...
Christine: Oh.
Em: So, during restoration efforts, new markers were put in, but guess what? There were no records of where all the fucking bodies were. And so now all of the markers that are put in are just best guesses.
Christine: Ooh.
Em: We don't know a lot of the correct locations unless there was some evidence previously. Umm, and there really wasn't a lot. So many bodies here were also never identified even the first time around when they were building out the cemetery. Umm, there's, there were no records of where the bodies were kept or who they were. A lot of them were unidentified. Umm, that's estimated that over 100 of the... Again, they're guessing that there's around 300 bodies in the cemetery, and they're guessing that over 100 of them are listed as unknown.
Christine: Wow. So a third of these people in the cemetery are like unmarked graves, or like unknown.
Em: It's like essentially a potters field or something. Yeah.
Christine: Oh, my lord.
Em: Umm, and this is a fun fact. It was more common back in the day for bodies to never be identified because nobody carried ID on them back then. There was no...
Christine: Fair point, yeah.
Em: Driver's license. Umm, so if you found... Especially in the wild west, people were just like dead on the side of the road all the time because of random shootouts. So if an undertaker had to go grab a body, and no one was around to identify them, and they couldn't identify the body, they would just take bodies and it was a common practice to just leave the corpse in front of their own parlor window. So that way as people walked by...
Christine: They could like say if they knew them.
Em: They could like check and be like, "Are there any corpses I recognize so I can go tell them who they are?"
Christine: Eww. Okay. Can I say one thing though?
Em: What?
Christine: Which I'm not trying to be, umm, mansplainy, but I do know this fun fact is that shootouts in the wild west were actually quite rare.
Em: Really?
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Fun.
Christine: That's what I get from my, umm, weird newsletter I signed up for about old wild west facts.
[laughter]
Em: Okay. Well, I don't know. There's lot of dead bodies everywhere.
Christine: I just thought I'd throw it out there. I didn't think that information would ever come in handy, but here we are. So yeah. But I imagine there were a lot of dead people of tuberculosis, of other shootings. Oh.
Em: Congratulations.
Christine: Oh, balloons. Yay!
[laughter]
Em: Umm.
Christine: Anyway, sorry. Just, uh, before somebody corrects, you know, I figured I'd just shout that out. But, but, yes. I imagine there were still a lot of dead bodies that could not be identified.
Em: Can you imagine though, like your regular, like Sundays, like, oh, we're gonna go to church, and then we're gonna grab something to eat, and we'll stop by the, the undertaker's parlor window just to see if anyone we know was dead in the...
Christine: Just do some window shopping to see if we recognize the dead bodies. Maybe that's what that guy's doing walking around outside. He's checking on...
Em: Maybe that... Oh, Cowboy Jake, he's looking for his friends.
Christine: That's sad.
Em: Oh God, that is really sad. Anyway, that was a common practice, I suppose, uh, at least in this area. So, uh... And a lot of people, if they did walk by the window, and they recognized someone but they like knew them from the bar, they'd be like, "Oh my God, that's Harry." And then they wouldn't know any other information. So a lot of these graves...
Christine: You know, Harry.
[laughter]
Em: So then a lot of the graves that do have names are just someone's random nickname with no other information.
Christine: Wow.
Em: Umm, that being said, to like... They knew that because of like morbid curiosity and dark tourism, people were showing up all the time to Boothill Cemetery, especially the people who are into like ghosts and stuff like that. So to bring in more tourism, the town decided that they were gonna get creative by adding additional fake memorials throughout the property just to give you something to read.
[laughter]
Em: So it wasn't like...
Christine: Okay.
Em: It wasn't like, umm... Like, you know those like fake Halloween graves that like have like a little rhyme about how someone died?
Christine: Yeah.
Em: They would just put those everywhere.
[laughter]
Em: Just like as like a... Just as in entertainment, I guess, but...
Christine: What?
Em: One of the most famous ones, which like this is on like merchant stuff now. It says here lies Lester Moore, four slugs from a 44, no less, no more. Umm.
Christine: Wow.
Em: And that's like their most famous one. So I think if you were to go to Boothill Cemetery, you'd have to take a picture with that. Umm.
Christine: Well, I'd get a... I'd for sure get a shirt. Do you, uh, do you think... So did they make these themselves or were they like just bought some... Like this was back in the day, right? So they made these themselves.
Em: I think they just... I think they made them. I think they made that as like part of the restoration project of like, "Look at like our version of what their stones might say if we knew anything about them."
Christine: Yeah. It's like one of these might be Lester, you don't know.
Em: Yeah. And some of them I think were inspired from other people that actually did die in other areas. So I think it was like, I don't know. I don't totally understand, but I'm here for it. I'm just like.
Christine: It's an interesting choice. Yeah.
Em: I would like to ask questions about it. Some of them were, umm, where they could find information, they would just leave like a very blunt explanation on the grave of how someone died. So one says "died in dispute", so...
Christine: Oh.
Em: You just assume that's like shot during a fight.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Umm, another one says "hanged". Another one says "legally hanged" which, what the fuck does that mean?
Christine: Wooferoo. I don't love that.
Em: Umm, but there's a lot of them popping around that you can see when you're there. But there are also ghosts at this cemetery. So people see mists floating by the grave markers. They hear footsteps behind them, they feel somebody grab them. And a lot of people have actually said they feel like they're walking through invisible spiderwebs.
Christine: Ugh!
Em: Like something's like got their hands on their face and pulling on them.
Christine: I almost said that earlier when you said people feel like something walks through them. And I'm... I was about to say, I feel like I've heard that described as almost like you're walking through giant cobwebs.
Em: Mm-hmm. That's exactly how people feel.
Christine: Bleh, ugh.
Em: Visitors have also seen, because there's always one, a lady in red. [laughter] Umm, and people think that she is the woman who used to run the opium dens in town.
Christine: Oh, what was her name? S... Uh, started with an S.
Em: Sing... I think it was Sing Choi?
Christine: Sing, sing, yeah.
Em: Umm, uh, apparitions are regularly seen walking through the graveyard, and they vanish right in front of you. I hate this one. People even see, clear as day, uh, faces poking their heads out from behind the tombstones...
Christine: Ah!
Em: And around the bushes at you.
Christine: Mm-hmm.
Em: People hear voices saying full sentences to them. One person stopped to look at a grave that they didn't know and just learn about the grave, and they heard a voice say, "It was nice of you to do that." And then it freaked them out, so they backed up. And when they got closer to the grave again, they heard the voice say, "You came back."
[laughter]
Christine: Oh no, I really wish...
Em: People...
Christine: This was all just part of like a Party City run that they did where they bought like the little motion activated... [laughter] But it sounds like not.
Em: Uh, people also claim to see one of the Clanton brothers, Billy Clanton, uh, and he's still walking around the cemetery. A lot of people say they see him heading back in the... Heading in the direction of back to town. There's even... This is one of my favorite things. There's even an alleged photo of this, of Billy Clanton walking into town. It is considered a very famous photo in the paranormal world.
Christine: Oooh.
Em: The photo is called... I have it for you. If people wanna look with us, it is called the Boothill Ghost, and it's said to be the ghost of Billy walking back to Tombstone. So here...
Christine: Oh, my lord. That is so cool. I haven't seen the photo yet, but just the...
Em: So I have the picture for you, and then I also have a zoom in for you.
Christine: Okay. Oh my God. I see it already.
Em: So, umm.
Christine: It's not the guy in the front, I'm assuming. [laughter]
Em: No, it's not the guy in the front.
Christine: It's not the full on cowboy.
Em: There it is, there it is, Eva. And then, umm, just so you can get a, uh, closeup...
Christine: A closeup?
Em: That is... That's what he looks like.
Christine: Ugh.
Em: And there was nobody there that day.
Christine: Full body.
Em: It was just...
Christine: Shivers.
Em: It was just this guy dressed as a cowboy to like go to Boothill Cemetery, totally empty that day, and they ended up seeing this guy.
Christine: Goose-fucking-cam. Do you know what, uh, year this was taken?
Em: Uh, I think in like the early 2000s?
Christine: Oh wow.
Em: But it was, it was definitely at a time when like photo manipulation was not common. It was like they've had, umm, char...
Christine: It's hard to tell 'cause it's in black and white, so it just, yeah.
Em: They've had like paranormal shows and like skeptics even try to recreate it, and the best they can do is that like a mannequin would've had to just be sitting out there like a scarecrow.
Christine: Oh, yikes. Oh, 1996. Just looked it up outta curiosity.
Em: 1996.
Christine: Yeah. Folks, you gotta look at this. It is creepy.
Em: It is just a full man walking through. And it's not even like on an open path.
Christine: I just ended up on the mannequin. I was like, I was just looking for the year, and all of a sudden there's like a mannequin on my screen. I'm like, oh, I must be on the same thing you looked at. Umm, wow. They did like a full... There's like lines to show like where the eyes are.
Em: A full investigation, yeah.
Christine: Yeah. Wow. This is intense.
Em: Well, like, if you look at the, or the main picture too, like, it's not like he's walking on an open path. That's in the middle of a, like a field.
Christine: Right, like in the shrubs.
Em: Like shoulder-high shrubs. So it's very weird for... It would make no sense for him to be doing that anyway.
Christine: And '96, you're right. Like that is way pre-Photoshop, uh, for, for the most part. Free... Sorry, pre-photo manipulation for the most part, yeah. Wow. That is Wild West.
Em: Umm, uh, what I was gonna say next is that the last thing I'll say is that Boothill Cemetery has its own gift shop, because so many people go there. And the merch goes missing all the time when nobody is looking, and not from people stealing the clothes, like the ghosts stealing the clothes.
Christine: What?
Em: Items get, items get messed with all the time. Their clothing rack spins by itself. Things get thrown off the racks. Like it's very haunted in this gift shop. And so, obviously, when I heard there was a gift shop, I almost broke my ankles running to it.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: And to commemorate this being our birthday episode, you have an official Boothill Cemetery mug being sent your way right now.
Christine: No way! Are you kidding?
Em: I'm just saying.
Christine: I need you to understand that you just really... I mean, you already know, but wow, you made my day. Wow.
Em: And, uh, with that, uh, I tip my hat to you, and that is the story of the OK Corral.
Christine: Em, that was so good. And the party hat's back. Em, that was so Good.
Em: And the party hat's back.
Christine: Can we go here, to this place?
Em: Yeah, I mean.
Christine: It sounds so fascinating.
Em: I would like to. Uh...
Christine: It just sounds so interesting, even just the history alone.
Em: I will tell you, this is where you were supposed to get your final surprise as a background, because now as we shift into your story, I wanted to take away... I didn't want the western scene anymore. I wanted to give, bring it back to birthday times. And so I made a whole background my little face was supposed to be sitting in. And here it is. Uh, this is through the power of AI, my friend. I looked up quite a few things.
Christine: I was gonna ask if this is...
Em: Let's take a tour since we can't, uh.
Christine: [laughter] What the fuck?
Em: Let's take a tour.
[laughter]
Christine: You are so ill. Okay. Okay. Whoa. [laughter]
Em: What would you... Where would you like to start? Let's start at the top. I used AI...
Christine: We gotta just... Yeah, we gotta just start.
Em: And as I tell you these, I will be sending the bigger versions of them so we can, people can swipe through these on Instagram.
Christine: Must we? Okay.
Em: This is AI Zak Bagans's holding a lemon.
Christine: That's an AI of... Okay. Oh, I see.
Em: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Christine: That's kind of amazing.
Em: Is that, like...
Christine: Good job, AI.
Em: It's like actually pretty good. I mean, if you zoom in on his face...
Christine: That's pretty damn...
Em: I really like his teeth. Those are crazy.
Christine: Yeah. I... Well, I think I'm gonna not zoom in.
Em: Umm, then you've got...
Christine: Okay, I wanna say, to be clear folks, just what we're looking at is a blank like sort of Ouija board template almost. And in papyrus font it says, "Happy Birthday, America's Hircine Shifter." Umm, and it has all these kind of border, like, uh, images that are really up upsetting, unsettling, upsetting. [chuckle] Umm, that Em has apparently created alongside with a robot. So, umm. [chuckle] Just...
Em: Yeah.
Christine: Do it that what you will.
Em: The first one in the top left corner of what would be a Ouija board is Zak Bagans holding a lemon. And, umm, it's very uncanny valley, 'cause it's almost right, and it's almost wrong.
Christine: It's almost right. It's almost right. Yes.
Em: Umm, below that, what my, my search was, umm, emo haunted cowboy celebrating his birthday.
[laughter]
Em: And...
Christine: It's literally a skeleton in a, like a leather jacket, a leather cowboy hat, all black, holding two balloons or three balloons. Beautiful.
[laughter]
Em: And then, and then below that, in the bottom left corner of what would be a Ouija board...
Christine: Yeah. What the hell is this?
Em: We have a crocodile eating, uh, weed gummies.
Christine: Weed gummies. [laughter] I was like gummy bears, jelly beans? What's happening? Weed gummies is delightful.
Em: Well, you like your crocodiles, and you like your weed gummies. So we had to combine them.
Christine: I sure do. Together is just perfect.
Em: And now if we... If we start back up at the top...
Christine: Yeah, what is that? Oh.
Em: That is, umm, an AI version... I typed in "Karmit the frog chugging red wine", but if you...
Christine: Oh yeah.
Em: If you zoom in on it, AI didn't know how to make someone chugging red wine. It was confused about whether it should use a bottle or a glass. And so he's act...
Christine: Oh.
Em: It looks like he's actually vomiting red wine into the glass from the top of a bottle.
Christine: Oh, Em, I think that's supposed to be a straw.
Em: Hmm, it's...
Christine: No?
Em: If you look at it, it's literally the top of a wine bottle.
Christine: Oh. Oh, I can't see it very close. Oh, you sent pictures separately. I'm so sorry. Oh, oh, I just opened it. The one that you sent, the original one, when you zoom in is really blurry, so I could not tell. Wow. It is literally... Looks like he's a fountain with a bottle of wine coming out of his mouth. That is upsetting.
Em: Now that you see the pictures clearly in our text message, like, isn't this lovely? Like, it's very well done.
Christine: Let's go back. Let me go back. Oh, the weed gummies one is bonkers.
Em: You gotta, you gotta look at Zak Bagan's teeth. You gotta look at Zak Bagan's teeth.
Christine: Oh!
Em: He's gonna eat you. He gonna get you.
Christine: Why would you make me look at this? Why is the lemon... Ew. He looks so scary. He looks like a wax figure that's been melted a little bit. You know? Like someone left it in the trunk for a little too long. [chuckle]
Em: Yes, Zak Candle Bagans.
Christine: Eww.
Em: And then, below, Kermit the frog chugging or vomiting red wine, we're not too sure, I had a UFO abducting a birthday cake, and that's what we have here.
Christine: Oh, that's good. That's good, Em. I like that one. Wow. This is so thoughtful.
Em: And then my personal favorite. Can you guess what the bottom right one is?
Christine: So that's where I'm looking. Is that supposed to be... Let me look at it again. Oh, did you send a picture of it? Let see. One moment.
Em: What do you think that might be?
Christine: Is that supposed to be the Hircine Shifter?
Em: That is America's Hircine shifter.
Christine: America's Hircine Shifter. Wow. I look regal as fuck dude.
Em: That's what AI thinks you look like. You're so pretty.
Christine: I am draped in an American flag. And if you know me...
Em: You're so pretty.
Christine: That's how I usually dress during the day.
Em: Yes, especially your very strong snout, that is akin to your every day.
Christine: Wow. This is actually so accurate.
Em: You know, I'm glad you see it that way. Anyway.
Christine: I love it.
Em: I worked very hard on that. And by me, I mean I typed a lot of things into AI until I got exactly what I needed. All for...
Christine: Exactly what you needed is also interesting.
Em: It to not totally work.
Christine: Yeah, that's unfortunate. I'm sorry.
Em: That's okay. Anyway, there is your birthday surprise, Christine. I hope you enjoyed all of it.
Christine: I feel that I'm almost experiencing it in a much more hands-on way, for better, for worse, mostly for worse. Thank you for this. The Karmit with the bottle of wine is now just really not how... Not, not enjoyable to look at when I realise it's not a straw. The Zak is really no.
Em: It's everything you've ever wanted. No?
Christine: No.
Em: Oh. [laughter] The crocodile with the weed gummies, I really... It does feel like your energy.
Christine: Now, that one, I'm on board. Emo skeleton, I'm on board. UFO, Hircine Shifter...
Em: Anyway.
Christine: Congratulations, Em, you are an artist, officially.
Em: Thank you. And congratulations, you're a birthday girl.
Christine: Thank you.
Em: So, I'm... I hope you had a good birthday episode.
Christine: I feel so... Man.
Em: And, let me... Hang on. Let me end on another one. I thought I got the ones that made the sounds, like the annoying ones, but it didn't work, so... Okay.
Christine: Wow. They're just silent...
Em: Now, I've done it.
Christine: They're just silent. Em, thank you so much. I obviously was not prepared for this, as you can tell, so I'm sorry.
Em: It's okay. It was in my phone alerts, apparently, so...
Christine: Oops. [chuckle]
Em: Good for me, preparing things. Um. Anyway, yeah, you deserve all the cowboys. By the way, when I started with the AI, it was originally just a Ouija board full of naked cowboys. So it...
[laughter]
Christine: Oh, okay.
Em: And then it...
Christine: You can just, you can just text that to me later separately if you want. [chuckle]
Em: I also, I also tried a lot of emo cowboys, specifically, but they're...
Christine: Now, that's interesting.
Em: AI only knows one cowboy hat, and... I looked up, I'm not kidding, probably 60 pictures of cowboys, and they all have the exact same hat, and it looked kinda stupid, so.
Christine: They're matching.
Em: They're matching. They're all on a team. And so, anyway, it ended up turning into other things, so, uh, HBD, girl.
Christine: Well, I'm delighted. I don't think... HBD. I don't think I've ever been so like see... Felt so seen. So thank you for that, um.
Em: To be loved is to be known, you know?
Christine: Yeah, that's beautiful.
Em: And to be known is to be loved.
Christine: Yeah. And I really appreciate you seeing me and loving me, and I love you back. And I'm so happy that it's also your birthday, even though I'm not living up to the same bar that you've set. I apologize. But I promise when it comes down to it...
Em: It was a...
Christine: I will be ready.
Em: It was a middle of the night, uh... The AI thing was last minute. I really thought I was just gonna do the whole western situation, and then I got too into it, so.
Christine: Well, I would say this is a gift for you, my story, but anything I say is just gonna be sad and bad. So I hesitate to say that it's for you, specifically; however, it involves gay people, question mark?
Em: Oh, that does it.
Christine: Yeah. Well.
Em: Do they die?
Christine: Yeah. [chuckle]
Em: Okay.
Christine: I know. I don't have like a good angle here. Um, let me think. Let me think. Let me think. Um, I could sing you a song. [chuckle]
Em: Oh, that's the... That's when you know Christine's scraping at the bottom of the barrel.
Em: Roses, roses. I wrote it for you.
[chuckle]
Em: Um, okay, like, okay, well, it's just gonna be sad. But hey, we got all of our happiness out of the way.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Everything's good, um, and now you're just gonna do what you do best, bum everyone out.
Christine: Yeah. It's my birthday.
Em: Tell us a story about people, regardless of what... [chuckle] Regardless of anything else, so...
Christine: Here we go. This is the story of the murders of Kylen Schulte and Crystal Turner. This is also sometimes called the Moab Murders. So, we're gonna get into it. It's actually a pretty recent story. So, Kylen Schulte, she was born September 5th, 1996 in Vail, Colorado and grew up with a passionate love for the world, everything in it, especially the outdoors. She loved to explore, loved to be outside, was a very friendly bubbly person, and was even described as having a childlike sense of wonder even as she grew up. Her whole goal in life was to travel and meet new people and see the world through different perspectives. Her brother, William, said she was always kind to everyone she met. And this is kind of like a fun fact about her relationship with her brother. Her brother, William, was put up for adoption when he was born and lived in Kentucky. And so Kylen didn't meet William until they were adults at a family reunion in 2018.
Em: Oh, wow.
Christine: And... I know. And so when they met, apparently Kylen wrapped William in a hug and said, "I can't believe it. I have a big brother." And so...
Em: Aww.
Christine: They were very close. And from that moment on, Kylen made William part of her life. They got really close as brother and sister. And now we move on to Crystal. So Crystal was born Crystal Michelle Turner on December 30th, 1982 in Hot Springs, Arkansas. And like Kylen, she grew up with, uh, a love of nature, a love of everything outdoors, uh, fishing, camping, hiking, you name it. And she also loved traveling and exploring, especially on her Harley-Davidson motorcycle. It was like her, her favorite thing.
Em: Is she the gay one?
Christine: I'll never tell.
[laughter]
Em: Okay. I think you just did, um.
[laughter]
Christine: Umm. According to one source, umm, Crystal once struggled with a substance use disorder, during which time she lost custody of the children she had from a previous relationship. But she worked hard at her recovery, and she was very proud of the life she was living. And then when she met Kylen, they fell in love. So they're both gay. Trick question.
Em: Mm-Hmm. Okay. Gotcha.
Christine: So they became...
Em: But well played, well played.
Christine: I wasn't even trying to play it, but you guessed. And I was like, I mean, technically you're right, but you could have guessed both of 'em and be right. So, they became inseparable. Umm, William, the bro... Uh, Kylen's brother, said everything Kylen did was for or with Crystal. I'd never seen love like that before. Like it was just the...
Em: Aww.
Christine: Cliche, like instant romance. Like they never left each other's sides.
Em: That's so sweet.
Christine: They were married in Arkansas in 2021. And both families admired the joy and love they had with each other, with Crystal's mom, Beverly, saying it was the most beautiful wedding she had ever seen. "They were both so happy. They were just so ecstatic." So Crys...
Em: God, that makes it so much harder already.
Christine: I know. It's terrible. It's terrible. Crystal and Kylen lived together in Moab, Utah. Do you know anything about Moab?
Em: You said it, and I had a twinge, and I don't know why. Umm, is there, is there like a stereotype to Moab? I know it's like, isn't it... Is it a desert? It's not a desert.
Christine: Yeah. It's basically where those, like... It's a beautiful part of the country. It's like where those red rocks, it's lots of red rocks, uh, canyons.
Em: That's why I, that's why I, I, I glitched for a second, 'cause hiking.
Christine: I believe that's where... Oh, Arches National Park is there. It's like a very outdoorsy... It's like the most picturesque Utah you can imagine with the arches, you know, and all that. So that's where they lived. They lived in Moab, uh, which is a popular tourist destination because it's so close to Arches National Park and other, you know, Moab desert type activities, recreationally. They were what you call van-lifers.
Em: Ooh!
Christine: They had a van, like a specialized camper van, that they travel and lived out of. Uh, however, unlike the ones that you see sometimes on TikTok who like travel year round, uh, or work remotely, they actually lived and worked in Moab full time. Umm, but they had on their, you know, off time they would take the van and go explore.
Em: This is where I get to do the thing you did to me about how there's not a lot of shootouts in the wild west.
Christine: Yeah. Tell me.
Em: Is that a lot of van life, umm, is very stationary, especially in the tiny house world. I feel like the, the people who travel everywhere, that seems lovely, but it's like so much wear and tear on your, on the car. Umm.
Christine: Yeah, sure.
Em: And a lot of people, esp... I don't know as much about van life, but I know especially with tiny houses, that, umm, most of them, it's not like... What's the way that they put it? Umm, it's like they, they say like, it's not a house on wheels, it's a house that happens to have wheels. And it's like, it's just easier because otherwise you have to figure out like sewage stuff, and you have to go find parking everywhere else. And you have... It becomes like a whole to do to be traveling so often, and it's so expensive to like constantly get your tires rotated. And so it's umm... It's actually not as common as a lot of like the trends make it seem.
Christine: Yeah. And I feel like a lot of that stuff on TikTok... Every time I see it people are like, "Oh, I wish I could live like this." And I'm always like, "Hell no." Like, that is not the life for me, man. As you, as I told you earlier, I don't even wanna go to soccer practice, let alone like drive around for the rest of my... I don't know. I'm like, just let me be at home. [laughter]
Em: Yeah, there's... There's, umm, like when I was bigger in the tiny house, uh, community, a lot of them would only move like maybe once every six months, once every year. And a lot of times it was just because there was like inclement weather coming, and so they would just drive somewhere.
Christine: Just out of like convenience or like safety. Interesting.
Em: Yeah. But usually once you're like grounded, you... It's just easier to just stay in one spot.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: And you just pick a really as convenient as you can spot. So.
Christine: Well, that makes a lot of sense. And that feels like exactly what was happening here is that they just found it like the right lifestyle to live and work in Moab but then have this van for when they wanted to explore. Umm, and they lived out of the van as well. And I will add, I was listening to the Mile Higher podcast, and they... Because they covered this story, uh, a couple years ago. And umm, they were talking about the difference between like RV life and like van life, because RVs are so much more... You have to find proper parking. You can only get gas in certain areas. You have to get the right permits. But with a van you can basically go anywhere a car can go. So aside from like rotating your tires, getting gas, all that, umm, it's apparently a much easier way to like move about rather than...
Em: Right.
Christine: Like setting up a whole uh...
Em: Okay.
Christine: RV sewage line and all that business, or whatever you have to do. Umm, so that's interesting as well. But yeah, so essentially they lived in Moab and they usually stayed there. They also worked there. Umm, but they had this van that they would camp out in and live in. And they were pretty well-liked and well-known in the community. Uh, Crystal worked at McDonald's. Kylen was a long-time employee at the Moon Flower Community Co-op grocery store.
Em: Oh.
Christine: And they would use their weekends and time off to go on adventures with the van. And they would always bring their pet bunny, Ruth. Uh, now that...
Em: Precious.
Christine: I feel like that would've been a TikTok sensation, like van life with a bunny named Ruth? That sounds... Even I would watch that.
Em: Yeah. Ruth the traveling van Bunny.
Christine: Oh, come on.
Em: Are you kidding me? I would just, I would just tip over today.
Christine: So cute. Umm, and so they lived much of the year at campsites in their area, and the same was true in August of '21. They set up camp in the La Sal Mountains near Moab, and they had just been married five months earlier, and they were in that pure honeymoon phase. They were living the dream. They spent their days working, hiking, spending time with friends, and just, umm, you know, getting used to married life. On August 13th of 2021, Kylen and Crystal had drinks in town with friends at a place called Woody's Tavern. Other people at the bar that night noticed the couple and described them as very much in love with each other, which makes me think like they were probably very cutesy in public.
Em: They, they had to be like just so...
Christine: They had to be.
Em: All up on each other. Yeah.
Christine: Yeah. And so, according to other attendees at the bar, the two of them were very focused on each other, very attentive to each other, umm, and seemed perfectly fine. Although, Kylen and Crystal did mention to their group of friends that there was a man near their camp, and they described him as creepy man.
Em: Great.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Like all you have to, all you had to say was there was a man near them, and they're queer.
Christine: I know. Bear!
Em: And I'm just like, oh, fuck. Like, yeah, bear, always the bear. Jesus.
[chuckle]
Christine: So both women decided they'd be more comfortable that night if they moved campsites so that they didn't need to be around this guy any longer. So what they decided would, was that they would come into town on Crystal's motorcycle and then leave that at the McDonald's parking lot while they take the Kia back to the campsite so that they could like move easier away from the campsite. So they left the bar at roughly 9:30 PM to pack up camp and find a new spot. And two days later, on August 15th, neither Crystal nor Kylen showed up for work. This was very unlike them. And when Crystal didn't arrive at McDonald's on the 16th either, and then Kylen missed her shift at the Co-op, all their friends knew something was very wrong, and immediately they were reported missing. When Word got to their families, Kylen's father, Sean Paul of all names...
[laughter]
Christine: Posted to Facebook that the women were missing. And this was on August 17th. He said they weren't in the hospital, they weren't in jail. He like called around to see if he could find them. And he pleaded with the Moab authorities to do a thorough search for both women whom he called "my girls"...
Em: Aw.
Christine: Which is like his daughter and daughter-in-Law. So the Schulte family held their breath, hoping for good news. Crystal's mother didn't have a smartphone or a computer, so she had to rely on friends to keep her in the loop about her own daughter being missing. Umm, some people suspected maybe they had gotten injured on a hike and were lost waiting for someone to rescue them. Other people considered maybe Crystal and Kylen extended their camp out and went off grid without telling anyone. But like their coworkers and their friends were like, no, they wouldn't just bail on work without telling anyone.
Christine: So, feeling lost. Sean reached out to a close friend. Sean is the father, and he's the one who kind of like spearheaded this mission to find the girls. He reached out to a woman he knew was a close friend of the girls, and her name was Cindy Sue Hunter. He asked Cindy to please help find Kylen and Crystal. And because Sean is not, uh, local to the area, he felt like he couldn't do as much as he wanted. So he asked Cindy, who did live in Moab, to go out on the ground looking. So on August 18th, Cindy set out with hiking supplies and a full tank of gas to search the La Sal Mountains where the women had been camping. She hoped against hope that she was conducting a search and rescue and not looking for the bodies of her friends. She scanned the edges of ravines and cliff sides. She would pull over to check areas where she thought maybe the brush looked disturbed. She imagined maybe they had gotten into an accident, like maybe the van went off the road over a ledge.
Em: Sure.
Christine: You know? She couldn't figure out...
Em: Especially because they like last minute were moving the van. They could've not been prepared.
Christine: Moving at night, yeah. Yeah. That's a really good point too. Like, if they were doing it quickly, 'cause they were kind of freaked out by that guy, umm, maybe something went wrong. So, at one point, Cindy finally got cell phone signal out there in the mountains, and she called Kyle's dad, Sean, and he mentioned to her... She said like, is there anything else you can think of? And he mentioned to her, well, you know, Kylen and Crystal had been complaining about a creepy man who had been around their campsite. And Cindy said when she heard that, it was almost like her heart sank, and she suddenly had to face the realization she might be looking for their remains rather than, you know, them being alive.
Em: Yeah. The second you hear... Again, always pick the bear, because the second...
Christine: Creepy man.
Em: You hear a man is involved, oh, well, they're dead.
Christine: Yeah. It's like, well, something terrible must have happened if a creepy man was lurking around.
Em: Mm-hmm.
Christine: So with a sinking feeling, she hung up, umm, and spent hours, like hours searching. Umm, it seemed like an impossible task for one woman to search 60 miles of road where they could have disappeared anywhere along this road. And because she had no direction, Cindy followed... This like makes me all, I don't know, emotional. But she followed what she called her inner voice. And she said she had this almost like intuition that she felt was like talking to her and telling her where to go, which I think is really powerful. So Kylen's aunt, Bridget Calvert, later said about Cindy, "She is an absolute hero, an angel, selfless, I really believe if it took her five days to find them, she would've taken five days." It was like she was so dedicated to this.
Em: Yeah.
Christine: But instead, it took only five hours.
Em: Oh.
Christine: And Cindy's intuition guided her to a campsite. She told ABC news she was about to take a turn when a voice in her head, whom she later said she believed was her own mother who had passed, a voice in her head said, "Go straight, please go straight, and hurry."
Em: Oh shit.
Christine: And she... I have goosecam. And she said, "I said to myself, I'm not crazy. I'm feeling this, I'm hearing this." So she went straight. She stopped at a campsite to ask if anyone had seen Kylen or Crystal. But as she pulled over, she noticed a Silver Kia, which was the make and model of the car that Kylen and Crystal drove; not the van, but their other car.
Em: Sure.
Christine: And she felt like her intuition had driven her straight here to this car.
Em: Yeah. I mean, that's incredible.
Christine: It is incredible, especially if you like consider the Moab desert. Like how are you gonna find, you know, where they were camping specifically? But she did. And so she called Sean right away to say, "Hey, I wanna make sure this is their car." She, you know, describes the car. He says, yes, I believe that is their car. So this is a huge break. And she notices there is a campsite beside the car. And Cindy said to Sean, "Things just didn't look, things just don't look right."
Christine: And she didn't wanna disturb anything, right? Because she wasn't sure if this was a crime scene, if she was allowed to mess with anything. She was a little scared, and so Cindy would just walked around and described to Sean what she was looking at. She... Uh, this moment must have been, uh, just terrifying. She went to the tent and had to look inside, and the tent was empty, but it looked like somebody had rummaged through their stuff. Umm, there were clothes near a tree on the ground. The tent door was slightly unzipped, which would've let bugs inside, so that didn't make sense. And there was also a cell phone just kind of dead and abandoned, uh, inside the tent as well. Finally, Cindy found Ruth, Kylen and Crystal's...
Em: Oh, fuck.
Christine: Beloved pet bunny, who was alive.
Em: Okay. Okay.
Christine: A little bit, a little bit like out of sorts, but alive. Umm, now she definitely knew this was... Like how many Silver Kias with a bunny rabbit are driving around? [chuckle]
Em: Right, right.
Christine: Uh, so she knew for sure this was definitely their campsite. And something must be wrong, because Ruth was alive, but her cage was filthy. Like it hadn't been cleaned in days. And that is not something Crystal or Kylen ever would've...
Em: Yeah, wouldn't have done that.
Christine: Yeah. No, no. And so she knew something must have happened to them. So, she apologized to the bunny, because she couldn't remember its name.
Em: Oh.
Christine: She was like...
Em: Wow, that really fucked me up.
Christine: I know. Right? Like, Cindy...
Em: I didn't know, I didn't see that coming.
Christine: Cindy is just very like, umm, I mean she works at this like co-op. She's a very artsy, hippie kind of presence, you know? And she was like a mother figure. And so I think like...
Em: Also... Yeah.
Christine: To her this was a very just emotional experience, and the fact that she knew how important the bunny was...
Em: I'm sure she's like just... She just wanted to be like caring and coddling...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: To something, and didn't know its name. And I think she just wanted to say sorry to someone. Like, umm...
Christine: I know, and she knew how important...
Em: Oh.
Christine: That bunny was to them, so it was like, "I wanna take care of this bunny, you know, on their behalf." So she apologized to poor little bunny rabbit, 'cause she couldn't remember its name. Umm, and she also told the rabbit she was sorry she couldn't immediately rescue her until authorities came to look at the scene just in case.
Em: Oh.
Christine: You know? She couldn't like let the bunny out or like mess with the cage. So she was like talking to the bunny like, "Don't worry, we'll help you." Umm...
Em: We'll be okay. We'll be okay.
Christine: Which also makes me wonder if like her intuition or whoever from beyond was also like, "Love my, love to my bunny." You know?
Em: Yeah.
Christine: I don't know. Umm, it was then, unfortunately, that Cindy spotted what looked to be a body in a creek near the campsite. Uh, she was still on the phone with Sean also. And for a moment, she was in denial about what she had seen, and she almost like shut down, like totally compartmentalized it, like put it away. She turned away from the remains and started just looking at the creek and thinking how beautiful it was out here. She started describing the creek to Sean. Umm, she said the water on the campsite was beautiful. Then she had to really like pull herself together and come back to the moment, and she forced herself to turn around and look again. And this time, she had to tell Sean what she was looking at. She said, "I see a body in the water."
Em: Which, keep in mind, like, imagine being like their dad on the phone...
Christine: I know.
Em: And like, you hear someone panicking because they just found your daughter's...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Bunny. Like you're, you're already fully panicking. And then for the person to just go, "The creek is really beautiful." I'd be like, "I literally... That's the last thing I'm thinking about right now. Like, I need you to get it together." [chuckle]
Christine: Yeah.
Em: It's like...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Like to be so helpless and like fully relying on this other person who's also going through...
Christine: To be your eyes and ears. Yeah, yeah.
Em: Like having to process while this other person is processing for the both of you.
Christine: Yeah. Yeah.
Em: It's crazy.
Christine: Yeah. So this is like obviously extremely traumatic for her as well. And then for her having to tell the dad on the phone.
Em: Yeah. She has to be the one to say it to someone.
Christine: Like, oh God. So just a terrible moment. Apparently, Sean of course immediately started crying and... But then he started yelling at her, "Get back in the car and leave."
Em: Yeah, so... He could still be there.
Christine: Yes, exactly. That was his immediate response was like, "You get out of there, 'cause that, whoever did this could still be there." Which I also thought was kind of poignant that he was thinking about her wellbeing as well in this moment, in like probably the worst moment of his life. Umm, and so Cindy thought, "Well, let me just keep looking. Maybe I can find Crystal." But Sean insisted she get to safety immediately. So Cindy locked herself in the car and called the police, who arrived, and it took them an hour to find her because she was so out in the remote area of desert that they had to like try and pinpoint where she was. Took them about an hour. Imagine sitting there for an hour having just witnessed all this and just like waiting, you know?
Em: Mm-hmm.
Christine: I mean, it's just a horrible, horrible day. So Cindy locked herself in the car. She's waiting for police who take about an hour to find her. And when they did arrive, they discovered that near Kylen's remains were Crystal's remains as well. So Sean updated his family, umm, in a group text and social media. And meanwhile, Williams's grandmother called him and told me that... So sorry. William's grandmother called him and told him that the women had been found, but unfortunately, his sister and sister-in-law were both deceased. And, at the time, he didn't know what had happened, and he believed maybe there was an accident in the mountains, like they had a car crash or they fell, or they got trapped somewhere in the wilderness. He didn't even realize what had happened. When in reality, both women had actually died of multiple gunshot wounds.
Em: Oh my God.
Christine: Yeah. Which is just... What the fuck is happening?
Em: Wow. That's in... That's... I don't think I was expecting gunshots.
Christine: No, I hadn't...
Em: I don't know what I was expecting, but it wasn't something that...
Christine: Same. I feel like a lot of these kind of wilderness murders don't usually involve gunshots, but you know, what do I know? So Sean, who, uh, was Kylen's biological father, but loved Crystal as his own daughter, said he couldn't believe somebody would kill his girls. Umm, he was so close with them, and he loved them both so much. And to add to this whole mess, the Schulte family had already lost a child in 2015.
Em: Oh, fuck.
Christine: Because Kylen's 15-year-old brother, McKean, was accidentally shot by his friend.
Em: Another by an... And also by guns?
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Oh my God.
Christine: Isn't that terrible? And he was 15. Essentially, what he had... What had happened was he was visiting a friend, and he was tapping on his window, like trying to get his attention, and the friend thought it was a burglar.
Em: A bad guy? Yeah.
Christine: Yeah. And shot straight through the window without looking and shot him right in the head and killed him. And this was a teenager whose parents just bought him a gun and allowed him to own a gun in his bedroom. So, you know, do with that information what you will, but...
Em: Wow.
Christine: So they had already lost a 15-year-old, and now their daughter had also been shot and killed. It's just like... I can't begin to wrap my mind around it. Crystal's mother, Beverly Dodd, found out from friends that her daughter had been murdered, because authorities failed to make timely contact, and she didn't have a smartphone or internet. So throughout the investigation, she really didn't receive many updates. She felt like completely in the dark about her daughter's death.
Christine: She didn't have people updating her regularly. Meanwhile, the Schulte family created a GoFundMe to cover the funeral expenses for both women, and donations came in from friends, from people around the world who both knew and did not know them. And the Moab community itself was especially shaken, because this was just so violent. And authorities said there was likely no danger to anyone else in Moab, but people were like, "Well, how do you know that? We don't even know who did this, and they were both shot repeatedly at a campsite, and now you're saying, oh, don't worry, everyone's safe." And so...
Em: Yeah, what?
Christine: It's believed that they were trying to just preserve the tourism, you know, and not make a big scene and not scare people away, because tourism is such a huge part of revenue for the city. And so, the attack seemed random, right, from the outside. Like, what if this guy is running around campsites with a gun, and now they're saying, don't worry.
Em: Yeah.
Christine: Everything's fine. And so people were wondering, what if the murderer struck again? And some people actually thought that he already had. Let me tell you why.
Em: Oh shit. Okay.
Christine: In a strange coincidence, a couple at the centre of another worldwide infamous case, missing persons case, had an altercation right in front of the co-op where Kylen worked. That would be Gabby Petito and Brian Laundrie.
Em: Shut up.
Christine: Just one day before Crystal and Kylen were last seen, Gabby Petito and Brian Laundrie were involved in a domestic dispute outside of the co-op where Kylen worked. And a witness called 911 and reported that Brian had slapped Gabby. I've not covered this case, but if this sounds familiar to anyone, it was very, very big...
Em: Yeah, huge.
Christine: On TikTok during Covid, and in the news, and it got a lot of... A lot of media attention. I will probably cover it one day, but just to give you an idea, these happened within days of each other, these two cases, which is just wild.
Em: That's also like... That's, like the coincidence of it happening.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Like, if you were to stand anywhere and think in a period of 24 hours two people in this exact same spot are gonna go missing...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: You would think there's a common culprit.
Christine: There has to be, right? Like, you'd think there has to be.
Em: Thats too weird. Yeah.
Christine: The statistics of that must be out of control. And so, police, at the time when Gabby Petito and Brian Laundrie were in this dispute, police spoke to the couple who were also van lifers, incidentally, but they were, you know...
Em: Yeah, what the hell?
Christine: TikTokers. They were, they were... That was their whole thing. They would vlog and all this. And the police said, "Okay, you guys need to stay away from each other. Take some time apart." So Gabby agreed to stay in the van for the night. Brian checked into a motel in Moab. When Gabby disappeared, her disappearance took the internet by storm, and TikTok, Twitter, YouTube, like theories abound. Like, I mean, it was, it was crazy. It got a lot of criticism as well, because content creators were seemingly or accused of treating the case like entertainment. One creator said, "This is true crime happening in real life." And another responded, "That's called crime. It is real life." Like don't call this like, oh, this is real life true crime. It's like all true crime is true. It's real, and it affects somebody.
[chuckle]
Em: Yeah, all real life.
Christine: Yeah, it is real life. That's the definition of it. I just had an Uber driver recently, and she was so nice, but she kept saying, "Oh, I love true crime." And I'm like, really? She's like, "Yeah, I watch a lot of true crime shows." And I'm like, which ones? She's like, "All the law and orders." And I was like, oh, Lord, that...
Em: Oh.
Christine: Thank God that is not true crime. [laughter]
Em: Okay.
Christine: That would be crazy if every episode of Law and Order and Criminal Minds was real. So, I was like, oh. I mean, I watch those too. I wouldn't necessarily call them true crime, but, you know. Uh, okay.
Em: Maybe broadly, broadly, broadly implying another case.
Christine: Yeah, like based on a maybe thread of a real story.
Em: Does it literally say based on, uh, based on other stories? Like it literally says it? [chuckle]
Christine: I think it even... It says... It does say something. It has like a screen at the beginning, or it says like these are all fictional. I think it says these are all fictional. I think it literally says that when the show starts, like this is not real. [chuckle]
Em: This true crime is fictional. Okay.
Christine: Yeah. This true crime is fictional.
Em: This true crime is not true. [chuckle]
Christine: Yeah. And so, that's why people were kind of up in arms. And the fact that it went viral as well was really hard to swallow, because there was also a lot of press... There was a lot of lack... Or there was a lack, I should say, of press regarding a lot of other cases, especially people of color, people who weren't white, blonde, vloggers. You know, there was just a lot of contention surrounding the Gabby Petito case and how much widespread attention it got versus, you know, other crimes that were happening against people of color, people of different economic classes, backgrounds. Just a lot of contention. It was a very fraught time. And so, because it was so viral, when this Kylen and Crystal story came out, it was sort of like, oh my God, they must be connected. You know, just like you said, like what are the odds? Right? And...
Em: And that's a fair first thought, is like...
Christine: Yeah, I really... I really think so too.
Em: That's fucking weird.
Christine: It's just weird coincidence.
Em: Yeah.
Christine: And so, before long, people began to speculate that maybe they were linked. And Kylen actually worked at Moon Flower, the co-op, the day Gabby and Brian were seen there and had their kind of falling out. And police were called to the scene just maybe minutes, an hour, after Kylen clocked out. So like, this was all happening simultaneously.
Em: That's so weird.
Christine: It's so weird. And so people, uh, considered maybe Kylen had seen this fight and maybe like she was the one who called police, because people thought, well, if they were fighting outside the co-op, maybe she's the one who witnessed him hit Gabby, and she's the one who got police involved. Maybe then Brian Laundrie felt like he wanted vengeance against her for involving the police. And maybe that's what had happened. People weren't really sure. But after several weeks, authorities couldn't really make any link, umm, or determine any official suspects. And so Sean decided he would come to the area. This is Kylen's dad. And he set up something he called a Clue Booth, and he said, "This is my Clue Booth. It is just set up right smack dab in Moab. And people can come by and give me any tips they have." So he almost set up like a little booth where people could come and campers, locals, anybody who might have a lead, they could come by, give him a tip, and then...
Em: Smart.
Christine: Move on. Yeah.
Em: Reverse detective agency.
Christine: Yeah. It's like, come to me.
Em: You tell me the leads.
[laughter]
Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's actually a great point. And I love that he called it his Clue Booth, 'cause that's just... I love that.
Em: You gotta have a name.
Christine: Gotta have a name, and I find that one very good. Umm, he stood at his booth every day, his Clue Booth, through August and September all the way until October 1st. And, during that time, he received a lot of tips about several suspicious persons. Uh, and authorities did pursue those tips, but there was barely any evidence linking them to the case. An anonymous local, at one point, advertised a $10,000 reward for information leading to the murderer. Then, a local company offered a second $10,000 reward hoping someone would come forward with anything useful. And in the meantime, authorities approached poor Cindy, who had found the bodies, and informed her that she was officially a suspect in the murder...
Em: Uhh...
Christine: Of... Because they couldn't wrap their heads around that she had followed her inner voice, and they thought there's no way in hell, she must have something to do with it. And so, they immediately looked into her.
Em: I mean, I guess from a skeptical view, she does seem like prime suspect number one.
Christine: And, I will say, like my own bias, if this were a man who was like, "I followed a bluh", I'd be like, "Hmm, really? Like, you know, prove it." Yeah. I would be, I would be suspicious. I would be. So, like I don't, I don't blame them for looking into her. I would say maybe the whole... Apparently, they put her through hell, and it was really terrible. Umm, she had to surrender her phone, and they were trying to build a case against her. Like they took it really far when there really was nothing linking her except that she found the campsite. Umm.
Em: Which like, I, I... That's why I, I very often don't... Umm, I don't blame people if they are like innocent, but still scared to co-operate with the police, because you're just stepping right into being looked at.
Christine: Exactly. Get a fucking lawyer immediately, 'cause like...
Em: Yeah.
Christine: You don't know. I mean, even if you have nothing to hide, like you don't know what might happen.
Em: Yeah. "What's your name?" Lawyer.
Christine: Right. Amen.
Em: "What's your age?" Lawyer. "Why were you there?" Lawyer. Uh, yeah, there's...
Christine: Exactly, "Why are you wearing that birthday hat?"
Em: Lawyer.
Christine: It's my friend's birthday. Dammit.
[laughter]
Christine: Umm, so they felt suspicious of her. They put... They were trying to put together a case. They took her phone, they basically put her through hell. Uh, there were bullet slugs left behind at the scene, which they thought like, okay, well we can maybe link this to the murder weapon. Authorities, meanwhile, also collected surveillance audio from a nearby location, which actually recorded gunshots and screams in the background.
Em: Oh my God.
Christine: Yeah. Which is really dark, because it was how they were able to determine when the murders took place. So they believe the audio captured Kylen's and Crystal's murders, which would mean it took place in the late morning of August 14th, not the night of August 13th as initially suspected. So it would've been like...
Em: Okay.
Christine: Early hours of the 14th. They also collected surveillance photos of a Toyota Yaris leaving the area just one hour after the attack. And this was kind of an unusual vehicle to see out there, because authorities are used to seeing, umm, camping vehicles, like all-terrain vehicles. But they...
Em: Big gay Subarus.
Christine: The gay Subarus, big gay Subarus. And so... Tiny house, I don't know. But, uh, this one was not quite a match. Like they're looking at this Toyota Yaris thinking like, all right, we'll just flag it, you know, for now.
Em: Mm-Hmm.
Christine: So as reports came out about the last time Kylen and Crystal were seen alive, people started criticizing the women's friends, umm, because the friends had told authorities and the media that Kylen and Crystal had complained about a creepy man near the campsite. And they...
Em: Right.
Christine: Even joked... Which like, this just feels so woman coded, but they joked, "If you don't hear from us, he probably killed us." And it's like...
Em: Yeah, I mean...
Christine: Wow, that's so fucked up.
Em: It's always, it's always a joke. And it's always not a joke.
Christine: It's always a joke until it's true. Yeah. It's just, it's just so...
Em: It's a joke that's only being said because it is kind of... We're still saying it, because it's a little true.
Christine: Yeah, 'cause it's based in reality. Yeah. So critics were like, "Well, why didn't your friends, why didn't their friends ask for more details? Like a physical description?" But those who knew the women, like the friends, said, "I mean, she was joking. Like, she said, oh, if something happens... You know? They were just joking. They're like, oh, this creepy guy. We don't like being around him." They didn't, they didn't think it was like... It's like hindsight is 2020. Like...
Em: Mm-Hmm.
Christine: They thought, oh, they're getting... And they said, "We're getting away from this creepy guy. We're moving campsites." And these are two women who are like perfectly capable of holding their own. It's not like they needed an escort back to their van. And so, people are blaming the friends, and it's like, that's... I, I don't think that's quite fair. And the guy hadn't done anything besides make them uncomfortable, which obviously looking back is very telling, but in the moment it's like, well, not much you can do.
Em: But also let's, let's talk about the fact that... Sorry to all the men listening, unless you're like on the right side and aren't gonna be offended by this. But like, it's so normal for women to feel uncomfortable around men.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: It's like, it's not like this was a milestone event.
Christine: This isn't like a, a shocking piece of information. Yes, exactly. That's such a good point.
Em: It was like, oh, it was a typical Tuesday. A man creeped me out and got a little too up in my business, and...
Christine: Yep.
Em: I have to just leave the premises. It happens every fucking day.
Christine: Every day.
Em: So it's not new. Yeah.
Christine: Every day. It doesn't mean like... If they had said, "Oh, this guy's walking around with a gun and threatening our lives", okay, maybe. But like, that was not the story they told. The story was just this man made us really uncomfortable.
Em: Like, a creepy man is like, is a weekly, sometimes for other people daily, event. Like it's just...
Christine: Right. Like imagine a doing... Working at McDonald's as a, as a cashier, like you would probably encounter creepy men all day. You know? It's like...
Em: Yeah.
Christine: Old news. And so, that's why the friends were... Even though they were put on blast, like I do not think that is a fair criticism. Umm, you know, at the time it like just didn't seem as critical as it does looking back. And so, Kylen and Crystal, like I said, were also experienced campers. They could hold their own. Umm, a family member said if they had actually felt like they were in real danger, they wouldn't have even gone back to the campsite. So they probably...
Em: Mm-Hmm.
Christine: You know, told themselves like, ah, we're overreacting. You know, that classic move of downplaying your concern or your fear. So Kylen's family exhausted every avenue they could imagine. There was actually a wedding taking place nearby the campsite the night they were killed. So Sean spoke to wedding attendees and asked if they heard anything. If they were so close to this shooting, like maybe they heard the gunshots or the screaming. And so, one of the, uh, attendees actually put together a spreadsheet of the entire guest list and where they were all staying that night, and then gave that to authorities to say like, "Interview these people. This is where they were." And so, Kylen's family and Crystal's mother spoke to newspapers and podcasts. They made social media pages. Like they just wanted this in the public eye. And it was finally in Spring 2022 when the police department and the FBI publicly named their prime suspect, and this was 45-year-old Adam Pinkusiewicz.
Em: Okay.
Christine: Pinkusiewicz. Pinkusiewicz? He went by Adam Pinkus, [laughter] so we're just gonna call him...
Em: Okay.
Christine: Adam Pinkus. So Adam was a Moab local who worked at the same McDonald's as Crystal, interestingly. He was an early person of interest when the investigation began, but hmm, wouldn't you know it, he skipped town immediately after the murders and no one knew where he went. So, as the investigation continued and more and more people were going to the Clue Booth and to police with their suspicions, people continuously brought up the name Adam Pinkus. And, you know...
Em: It's weird how many people would know him.
Christine: Would know him?
Em: Like how many people would say his name sep... Like individually from each other?
Christine: Oh, well, he worked at the local McDonald's with Crystal, so I think...
Em: They're just... I mean, but like were they mentioning other employees at, at McDonald's, or was he just like particularly notably creepy for everyone to be talking?
Christine: Oh, he... Oh, he was just a creep. He was just a creepy dude.
Em: Okay, okay.
Christine: People were basically like, oh, if somebody killed somebody, he's the only one I can think of. Like, he was just the immediate stand out, and...
Em: Damn. Imagine if he didn't do it, that would be like a crazy reputation that everyone has for you.
Christine: There's some debate, there's some debate. There's some debate. Yeah. 'Cause some people say he really wasn't that creepy. We'll get into it. So anyway, some people who knew Adam even posted on social media that they believed he was involved and that the FBI needed to look into him. And what we do know about Adam is he was an unfriendly person, very aggressive with his coworkers. He once was even forced to clock out of work early because he started an argument with a manager one day. And, on a personal level, he did not like Crystal. He was, uh, very homophobic to begin with. And sometimes Crystal came in when she wasn't working to grab like a, a, umm, quarter pounder for herself and, and Kylen. And the manager was totally okay with this, because Crystal worked there and was allowed to come in and grab some food. But apparently, one day he saw this and accused the manager of giving her preferential treatment because the manager was also in a lesbian relationship. And he said, well, you're just giving Crystal preferential treatment to get sandwiches because you're both gay. And they were like, no, like anyone can come get a sandwich. And also like, what is it to you? Why do you care?
Em: Yeah. At that point I'd be like, "Sure, I guess so. And you're not invited." Like...
Christine: Yeah, I guess so. Yeah, like, go make you're own. You can, you can eat a sandwich too. Big whoop. Uh, it's just so weird. So there was like a long standing history of him being very aggressive with, uh, multiple members of staff and being pretty homophobic. And it's unclear whether she... Whether Crystal even knew that Adam had a problem with her, or they... They actually never worked shifts together. And so it's like unclear. And that's where the, there's kind of a sticky bit for me, which is like, well, wouldn't she know him?
Em: Right. 'cause she kept saying creepy guy, wouldn't...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: She know it was like a guy from work?
Christine: From work. So that's where the hangup is a little bit, umm, for me, but, you know, it's entirely possible. It sounds like they did not interact really at work or, you know, didn't really know each other very well. Umm, apparently when Adam made this complaint to the manager, he didn't realize she worked, that Crystal actually worked at the McDonald's. He thought it was just like a friend of the managers. So maybe...
Em: It's like you and your lesbians are just giving out sandwiches to other gays, yeah.
Christine: Yeah. Like taking over. Yeah, exactly. So maybe that's just what he... Like, maybe they just didn't interact ever and so she didn't recognize him. Umm, in the Mile High podcast, Kendall was saying like, well, maybe he was in disguise, like maybe out in the... Out in the wood, mountains, maybe he had a mask or like a bandana, who knows.
Em: Also, it was dark out too. He could've just had a hoodie on.
Christine: And it's dark out, yeah. And so, you know, they did talk to the creepy man at the campsite. So, you know, you'd, you'd think maybe like if they had talked before at work that she would recognize him, but maybe she just didn't put that together. Maybe she'd never talked to him at work. Who knows. But that's a little bit... Some people have like a little hold up on that. Umm, but either way, uh, they start looking into Adam, they announce that he's their prime suspect. And, uh, incidentally, Adam drove a Toyota Yaris, the same vehicle that was...
Em: Uh-oh.
Christine: Leaving the area shortly after the killings. And investigators began to suspect that Adam was the creepy guy hanging around near the women's campsite and had followed them into the mountains after work. So a private investigator hired by the women's family disagreed. And he actually assumed that Crystal would have recognized her coworker, like we were just saying, and named him instead of like just saying, oh, creepy guy. Uh, and this, this, uh, private investigator suspected the creepy guy, maybe it was just a coincidence. Like maybe there was a creepy guy, and it wasn't even creepy guy who killed them, but like, they had just happened...
Em: Right.
Christine: To talk about him a few days earlier and then this happened. Who knows? But Crystal and Adam didn't work the same shifts and company policy required McDonald's, this is a thought I had as well, to wear masks because of Covid at the time. So it's like...
Em: Oh shit. Right.
Christine: Maybe she didn't even see his face at work, you know?
Em: She Just didn't know who he was, yeah. Or what he looked like.
Christine: Yeah. And all you have to do is wear a hat and a mask and then you can't really see much. And so it's entirely possible that like Adam was the creepy man. Umm, but either way, whether he was or not, all the investigators believed he was their best suspect. The only issue is that he had died by suicide on September 24th, 2021, just over a month after the murders. So...
Em: Adam?
Christine: Yes.
Em: So there's no catching him.
Christine: No.
Em: Or even asking him questions?
Christine: Nope. Nope.
Em: Okay.
Christine: He took his own life.
Em: Well.
Christine: So, the investigators had to put together basically any pieces they could that he left behind. Umm, they did note that the, uh, bullets used in the murders did match, uh, those used again... Or those that were in the weapon he used. So his weapon matched the bullets, I should say, that killed Kylen, Kylen and Crystal. And a grocery order receipt showed that Adam had purchased them on August 13th, and that was the...
Em: Oh shit, the day before.
Christine: Last day, yep exactly, that they were seen alive. So, at the bar, they had told their friends that the creepy man near their campsite had left for a while that day and had returned with groceries.
Em: Oh fuck.
Christine: Weird. Also, Adam, when he skipped town right after the murders, he deleted all of his social media when he left Moab, along with photos, texts, any other media that they could have looked through and used as evidence. It was like he wiped his stuff clean, which is fishy. It's not nec...
Em: This guy did it. I think he did it.
Christine: Yeah. It's not like necessarily hard hitting, but it's definitely fishy. Umm, however, he did leave behind a bunch of notes he wrote in his phone describing frequent thoughts of things like violence, rape, and racism.
Em: Oh.
Christine: Uh, he was very mentally unstable. He had a lot of mental health issues, and that could have played a part in, in this, that could have played a part in if he did kill them. But either way, he had threatened violence against his McDonald's manager, and some of his coworkers reported that he had made hateful comments about his manager's sexuality.
Em: Mm-Hmm.
Christine: And in the note he left behind at his death, he said he had been fired by his "lefty liberal bosses".
Em: Okay.
Christine: Yeah. And he also sent his family a strange and concerning email that they described as a goodbye, and that was actually sent hours before the murders.
Em: Oh.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: I mean, he did it. I think.
Christine: Finally, investigators found references to a man they described as Adam's significant other who lived in another state.
Em: Mm-hmm.
Christine: It seems like they had a very fraught relationship. And when authorities contacted this unnamed man, he told them that Adam had confessed the murders to him.
Em: Well, there you have it.
Christine: Well. And he actually, this significant other of Adam's, apparently knew details that not even the women's families knew. For example, he said that Adam had shot them in their tent and then moved their bodies to the creek. And only investigators knew this. This was not public information. The families did not know this. He also told them that Adam said he worked with one of the victims and he disliked her because she was bossy.
Em: Bossy?
Christine: And... Bossy.
Em: Okay.
Christine: Sure. And the man claimed he did not contact authorities because he was afraid for his life. He was afraid of Adam. And now that he knew this information, he was afraid Adam would hurt him. And he did not realize that Adam had taken his own life. So he was kind of living in fear until investigators found him. So when investigators figured this out, they felt they had enough evidence to not only arrest Adam if he were alive, of course, but also to prosecute and convict him of the murders. Umm, but again, of course, he had already passed. So in late 2022, which would be more than a year after the tragic murders, police and the FBI officially closed the case and released details of the investigation publicly naming Adam as the killer. And although they could never truly understand the motive, like why Adam would kill Crystal and Kylen, umm, the women's loved ones at least could now put to rest like who did this, you know, uh, and know that he'll never hurt anybody else. So there was at least a bit of closure there, umm, especially for Sean who posted a video about how relieved he and happy he was, that they had found the guy who did this.
Em: Mm-Hmm.
Christine: Cindy, of course, was no longer a suspect. Umm, but she said that...
Em: Good.
Christine: Despite the fear and stress, she would've done what she did all over again. She just seems like an angel.
Em: She's a homie.
Christine: She is... She seems lovely. Umm, she told re...
Em: I hope she got the bunny rabbit.
Christine: I hope she takes care of the bunny rabbit. Wouldn't that be sweet? Aw.
Em: That'd be nice.
Christine: She told reporters, "It's made me understand why people don't come out and help when they ask for help, because the person that does the good deed gets blamed." So basically what you said, Em, of like no good deed goes unpunished. Like, she's trying to help and now she's having her whole life turned upside down. So ultimately, she just wanted Kylen's and Crystal's families to have closure, so she did not regret following her inner voice. Kylen's and Crystal's families held services for them in Montana and Arkansas. Kylen was laid to rest near her brother, who she was really close to, the one who had been shot.
Em: Mm-Hmm.
Christine: Sean asked that everyone remember the women for their lives, for their love of the outdoors, of everyone they met, and of course, for each other. And when their obituaries and memorial announcements were posted online, people shared beloved memories of the women. Some were posted by family and close friends, but other commenters said they only met the couple briefly on hiking trails and at campsites, and they had remembered them fondly. Even then, Kylen and Crystal had made lasting impacts. Um, people just met them once on the trail and never forgot them. So Kylen's Aunt Bridget said the light of their undying love will shine on. And apparently their favorite flowers were sunflowers and roses respectively, and so a lot of the memorials to them have featured sunflowers and roses. And, um, apparently when, uh, crystal was cremated, they sent Kylen's family, uh, like a necklace with some ashes in it to bury with Kylen in her grave, um, so that they could be laid to rest together.
Em: So sad.
Christine: I know. It's really fucking sad. And I'm sorry it's your birthday.
Em: Yeah.
Christine: Oops.
Em: I feel really stupid in this hat.
Christine: Sorry. I know your hat... Halfway through I was like, oh, poor Em is wearing that fucking hat. Um, [laughter]
Em: Like a little kid holding a lollipop, and it's just raining, so they can't go to the park or something.
Christine: You just have like a cone with the ice cream on the floor. It's just like so sad. [laughter] Um, and I wanna add too, which like was not in these notes but is important to note, that the private investigator, or at least one of them who believed it was not... That they did not have the right guy, that Adam was not him, was Dog the Bounty Hunter, [laughter] who was...
Em: What?
Christine: Heavily involved in this case. And, uh, he believed...
Em: Did not see that coming.
Christine: That uh, that they got the wrong guy. And he said... In an interview, he said, the guy we have we think, we think is the right guy. But he, uh... Dog the Bounty Hunter was also very involved in the, obviously the Brian Laundrie case. So it makes sense that he was kind of in, in this circle. Um, but I think one of the big... I don't know, there was a couple criticisms about, you know, the handling of this case, but with, uh, especially right after Gabby Petito. Because it was like the same area, same police force... And I don't know if you know this, Em, but Dog the Boundary Hunter was the one who swooped in and like discovered Brian Laundrie, found Brian Laundrie And so when the...
Em: I don't think I knew that. No.
Christine: Yeah. So when police were on this case, they were... And Dog the Bounty Hunter showed up, they were like we gotta handle... We gotta do this ourselves. Like Dog the Bounty Hunter is fucking giving us a bad name.
Em: Wow.
Christine: Like, we're gonna look like fools.
Em: Go Dog. Well...
Christine: I guess so. I know he's very controversial. I don't know the details, but, so I don't...
Em: Oh. I don't know enough about him. I just know his name.
Christine: I don't, I don't either. So I just, I think it's probably just...
Em: Yeah, usually when it's, um, like...
Christine: The nature of what he does, I don't know.
Em: When it's, um, true crime, like all the Gabby Petito stuff, I just like actively swiped away because I knew eventually you'd cover it, so I...
Christine: Yeah, you're like, I don't wanna know yet.
Em: I was just like, I don't know. So no, the Dog the Bounty Hunter thing, did not see... That is... I'm probably the last person to know that, but it's still super cool.
Christine: Maybe not, you know? Um, but...
Em: Fun fact.
Christine: 'Cause that case was weird in and of itself without Dog the Bounty Hunter. So there's a lot happening. But, um, but yeah, that is the case. It's, it's obviously pretty tragic, incredibly tragic. Um, but yeah, be careful out there folks. Trust your gut. Um, trust your inner voice, so to speak.
Em: See something, say something.
Christine: See something, say something. And uh...
Em: And be careful and...
Christine: Pick the bear.
Em: Always choose the bear [laughter] Always choose the bear.
Christine: We both said that. Oh gosh.
Em: Um, yikes. Well, good job, Christine. Although...
Christine: Thank you.
Em: I will say like, in terms of like birthday party, this is just a little bit of a wash, so.
Christine: Look At that. [laughter]
Em: It's just me with my...
Christine: It's raining on your birthday. [laughter]
Em: You know, one day for our birthdays, we'll just tell happy stories. Um.
Christine: Will we? Nobody wants that.
Em: If we break the rules. Yeah. I don't know how we would do it, but maybe we could do one of those, um, real true crimes. Like we could just tell an Elliot Stabler story.
Christine: A real true crime. Yeah, we'll just read the script. We'll just do like a...
Em: And also a real Zak Bagans story, and then we'll just...
Christine: Yeah. We'll do a table read of Ghost Adventures and Law and Order. [laughter]
Em: Okay. But I get to play whoever Mariska Hargitay has to kiss. Uh oh.
Christine: Uh oh. I get to play, uh, what's his name?
Em: Mariska Hargitay, ah. [laughter]
Christine: That's the plot twist.
Em: Um, I was just watching the new, uh... Or not the new, I, I'm watching the very first season of...
Christine: Munch.
Em: Law and Order. Munch, oh.
Christine: No, I'm BD Wong. I'm BD Wong.
Em: You are BD Wong.
Christine: I love BD Wong.
Em: Um, I'm rewatching the very first season right now. And wow, they had a completely different vibe than the rest of the show. And Mariska Hargitay...
Christine: Oh, SVU, you mean?
Em: Was actually like... Yeah, she was like actually like hooking up with people and everything in the first season. And now...
Christine: Oh It was a while. The first season is out of control.
Em: The most lawless, ironically.
Christine: The most lawless. I mean, it, they literally use the like slurs left and right, like it's just rough.
Em: Oh, that was like through like season 10, I think.
Christine: I think so. But yeah, it, like...
Em: Whew!
Christine: It's just painful, uh, a bit painful.
Em: The amount of times that they like find a way to insult like trans people or people in drag when there's not even, that's not even in the storyline, they're just thinking like...
Christine: They just like say it...
Em: A potential options of a suspect. They're like...
Christine: They're like, maybe...
Em: Oh, well what if... What if they were in drag?
Christine: They were a... Yeah.
Em: Oh no.
Christine: Wearing a skirt. [laughter]
Em: I'm allowed to say it. Uh, Stabler loves the word he-she. He loves the word.
Christine: Oofa, Doofa.
Em: I'm like, every time he says it, my, my, my little non-binary ears go, "What the fuck did you just say?" Uh...
Christine: And I love that you're the one that keeps watching this fucking... Like, it's like your favorite show. [laughter]
Em: Yeah. But then in my mind I'm like, ah, you get a pass today, Elliot. I guess. So I'm like...
Christine: I know, you're like silly Elliot. He's the only one allowed to say that.
Em: I'm like, he didn't know any better. And then, um.
Christine: Ice Tea, you silly goose. [laughter] You say slurs.
Em: Yeah. He's Iced Tea, he's always... He... So many. And the way... By the way, I think they... Oh, they absolutely do. In a few of the episodes, they like say like the N-word and everything. Like they say like every single bad word.
Christine: And it's like, how lawless was 1999 television that like we didn't even blink? I don't know.
Em: Didn't blink. Yeah. I... 'Cause as I watch it now, I'm like, holy shit. And like, they still haven't blocked it out now. Like you would think they would like put a mute or something, or a warning, because it's like the... The one episode I'm thinking of is when they're literally like, like white supremacists are saying it.
Christine: Whoof.
Em: It's not even like, like someone of color is saying it.
Christine: Yoh.
Em: And they're saying it like to Fin. Like they're saying it...
Christine: Whoa.
Em: I'm like, Jesus Christ. Like how is that okay?
Christine: To Tutuola?
Em: Oh to Fin Tutuola [laughter]
Christine: Whoza. Dooza. I cannot believe that. That is rough. Yeah. I have to start at like season 10. I can't, I can't, it just like makes me crazy to watch the earlier ones.
Em: Uh, the, the worst, uh... This is where you get attacked because they uh, they say a lot about bisexuals and how they're not real.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Oh my God. [laughter] It's just like, nobody is safe. Nobody is safe.
Christine: Nobody is safe.
Em: On that fucking show.
Christine: Yeah.
Em: Um, yikes. Wow. Anyway, somehow my comfort show, yuck. Um, every time I...
Christine: I think it's a lot of our comfort show. I think we're finding a lot of people who are like, phew, I'm glad I'm not the only one who watches this even though it's like pretty problematic early on.
Em: Yeah. And now, I mean, if they were still doing it, we'd be like, "Oopsies, that's not good."
Christine: Well, sure, yeah yeah, yeah sure.
Em: But, uh, but I watch it now and when I hear a slur... [laughter] I wish you could see my face when I hear them say a slur. I go, oh. And then I go, uhh, it's then, I guess you didn't know, but I...
Christine: Hmmm...
Em: You should have known.
Christine: I guess '90s, we were saying that back then? I was eight. I don't know.
Em: Yeah. No [laughter]
Christine: No, definitely not.
Em: Anyway, Mariska, Stabler. I don't know how we got here. That's how I'll celebrate my birthday. I'll watch some new Mariska stuff and see what she's up to.
Christine: I'm gonna check on BD.
Em: He's doing good, I think. He's, he's floating around.
Christine: Gotta love him.
Em: Saving lives. Gotta love him.
Christine: Gotta love him.
Em: Gotta love him. Uh, okay, well, what do we do now? I guess we go do an after hours?
Christine: Yeah, let's go talk after dark. I wonder what's darker than this? Um, oh no, it's after dark, so it's supposed to be less dark. Hmm. That's easy. We'll find something.
Em: Interesting. Well, you could put your weird little hue thing back on and be raptured upstairs. And, and then...
Christine: My hue? [laughter]
Em: That'll Be, that's...
Christine: Yeah.
Em: That's the opposite of dark. Sure.
Christine: I'll Change my contrast settings and just wash out my screen. That'll be nice. [laughter]
Em: Okay. Uh, I'll see you over there?
Christine: Okay. Love You. Bye.
Em: And.
Christine: That's.
Em: Why.
Christine: We.
Em: Celebrate our birthdays.
Christine: Happy birthday.