[intro music]
Em Schulz: Hello. It's Em at 100% full potential. And it's Christine who, umm, we are gonna be getting a [laughter], a, a low, a low energy from the... Christine today. So I will be carrying the humor, everybody. Umm, Christine, how are you feeling?
Christine Schiefer: Like fucking trash. Thank you. This is like probably the worst. Like, I'm really, I'm trying my best...
Em Schulz: With love...
Christine Schiefer: And my fear...
Em Schulz: With love...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: You don't look good.
Christine Schiefer: I don't. I know.
Em Schulz: Yeah. [chuckle]
Christine Schiefer: And I also sat right next to a window with, and I like, have no makeup on uh, or anything, and I sat like directly under like the 2:00 PM sunlight blaring at me, and it looks like I'm death warmed up. Like I look like a corpse today. Umm...
Em Schulz: Are you okay? Are you okay?
Christine Schiefer: No. [laughter] I am not, thanks for asking. I am really, truly, in bad shape, but it's fine. Umm... I... Okay, I...
Em Schulz: Christine's having a, a, a bit of a flare, and...
Christine Schiefer: I am.
Em Schulz: Did you not wanna share that?
Christine Schiefer: And it turns...
Em Schulz: Did I, did I just [0:01:17.4] ____ through it?
Christine Schiefer: No, no. Ab... Listen, I share anything and everything. I mean, I think the first week... When I first thought about discussing this today, I was like, [chuckle] oh, I can say, you know, I, I'm so old now that I'm always sick, but then I remembered that like 2017, the year we started the podcast, we posted photos of you visiting me in the hospital. So apparently, I've just been ill for... [laughter] Forever.
Em Schulz: I think you're just reconciling with the fact that... Also, for someone who's chronically ill, for you to be having the realization now that you're always sick, it's like, yeah, girl, you're chronically ill. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: I know, but that's, that's kind of what I was saying the other day. I was like, man, I, it's just like when it's in remission, you forget...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Like how bad it is. And then suddenly, it like shows up and you're like, what is this? And Blaise is like, your, your partner who's a little smarter than you sometimes, is like, umm, my love, it's your chronic illness and you're like, no, couldn't be that. Umm, but...
Em Schulz: You know...
Christine Schiefer: Anyway, what...
Em Schulz: I... Go ahead. You, you...
Christine Schiefer: I just...
Em Schulz: You take the reins here.
Christine Schiefer: I ate too many dumplings again, and I do this every time.
Em Schulz: Oh.
Christine Schiefer: It's the dumpling. It's the second time that I be... Last July, I ate too many dumplings...
Em Schulz: That's not a joke? That's really because you're eating dumplings?
Christine Schiefer: No, it's not a joke. Yeah, it's real. I... In New York, last July, I ate too many dumplings on the plane. I was like, I think I have the flu. I got home and I had like a, uh, a a bowel obstruction and umm, it ended up going away after a while, but it was like hell on earth. And then, the other day, my dad's partner, who is Chinese, brought like these unbelievable dumplings to our Super Bowl watch party...
Em Schulz: Oof.
Christine Schiefer: And I ate a lot of them, and I knew I shouldn't do it, but I did it anyway. And then about 5:00 in the morning I woke up and thought, wow, I think I have COVID... [laughter] Like what could this be?
Em Schulz: Yeah. Christine texted all of us saying, it's, without a doubt, it's so bad. It must be COVID. I must be like...
Christine Schiefer: I was like there... I... I was like, I don't think I've had 103 plus fever that I like can't get down with like, full doses of Tylenol in, uh, since I had COVID, like I was like, I cannot get my fever down. I'm so sick. I was like, I might have to go to the hospital anyway. It's 'cause I have another partial bowel obstruction, so that's nice.
Em Schulz: Oh no!
Christine Schiefer: Umm, yeah, so basically what happens is that your intestines get so inflamed, sorry, TMI everybody, umm, that they kind of constrict and then you... They can't pass any, like, anything.
Em Schulz: Mm.
Christine Schiefer: And so they get like blocked and so oftentimes, require surgery. The last time my doctor told me, these don't pass on their own, so we are gonna require surgery if this is really what's happening. And I said, ha ha, nice try. And I somehow survived it. So I'm hoping I can do it again. [laughter]
Em Schulz: So you're mid bowel obstruction currently?
Christine Schiefer: Currently. I'm in, I'm in some pretty severe pain, umm, but also have a high fever, not a high fever, mild low grade fever because it's like this constant, you know, inflammation. So, I've just sweat through all my... I wear like six shirts a day, 'cause I'm like constantly [chuckle] sweating through my clothes. I just feel like I have the flu plus food poisoning at the same time. Umm...
Em Schulz: Do you just wanna record tomorrow, homie?
Christine Schiefer: No, 'cause I thought, oh, well, like let's record tomorrow. And then I was like, well, shit, I'll probably feel worse tomorrow. You know? I don't know. I was like...
Em Schulz: Why?
Christine Schiefer: I feel okay... I don't know. 'cause it, I don't think this is just gonna go away very quickly, so I was like, I might as well just do it on a day where I'm like functioning-ish. Anyway...
Em Schulz: Do you want like... Okay, I know we're mid recording currently but like, do you like want like Eva to hop in and like take your place or something? Like...
Christine Schiefer: Oh no, I will be...
Em Schulz: We can make it work without you.
Christine Schiefer: I will be just... How dare you? No, I'm kidding. Umm, no, I'm totally fine.
Em Schulz: If you're... If I were in this severe pain, I'd be like, I literally, I'm just not gonna do it. You're...
Christine Schiefer: I just...
Em Schulz: This is like talking to Taylor Swift and she is like, I have the flu, but the show must go on. And I'm like, okay, relax. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: And you... What, what do you say to Taylor Swift? Oh, someone can replace you? I don't think so, Em.
Em Schulz: Uh, I don't know.
Christine Schiefer: Nice try.
Em Schulz: I, I feel bad. I just feel really bad for you, so.
Christine Schiefer: Well...
Em Schulz: I don't know...
Christine Schiefer: I appreciate it.
Em Schulz: 'Cause I'm... I don't know how to keep the, the party going if, umm...
Christine Schiefer: I'm, I'm partying it up. Okay? I took a Tylenol. Umm, the thing is it... You apparently have to wait six hours in between doses of Tylenol, so I've just been setting timers.
Em Schulz: This feels wrong.
Christine Schiefer: It feels wrong.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: It feels like I shouldn't be making you do this.
Christine Schiefer: It feels illegal. No. Oh, no, no. This? This is fine. This is a nice distraction. Do you know what otherwise I'd be doing is watching Schitt's Creek and just cry... I keep crying because Gio I think he loves me 'cause he comes to like comfort me, but then I realized he found a goldfish under my pillow.
Em Schulz: Uh-huh.
Christine Schiefer: Umm, and so I've been crying a lot about that, but otherwise, I'm totally fine. And I might even like, take partially this weed gummy that I took for, when we recorded BeachTooSandy the other day, 'cause it's supposedly really good for chronic pain.
Em Schulz: Eat the whole thing, Christine.
Christine Schiefer: Umm... I might eat the whole thing and it's, it...
Em Schulz: I'd like to watch you do it right now.
Christine Schiefer: Uh. Okay. I didn't take it last... And by the way, for everybody who's a square, it's a, it's Delta-9. It's federally legal. Okay? Umm, but I took one for BeachTooSandy, and I...
Em Schulz: I don't even care anymore, just eat it.
Christine Schiefer: Just... Just eat it. Okay.
Em Schulz: Just eat it.
Christine Schiefer: Uh. Yeah...
Em Schulz: I would like to... All right.
Christine Schiefer: Anyway, I'm ready to go.
Em Schulz: Does it taste good?
Christine Schiefer: How are you? [laughter]
Em Schulz: Okay. Well, like we're not even gonna [0:06:32.3] ____ cover it, right?
Christine Schiefer: I'm sorry. I'm really trying to not be a fucking downer. I'm not. I'm, I'm just happy to have something positive to do for once. Umm, because, you know, Valentine's Day was kind of just spent umm, doing things that I'd rather not be doing.
Em Schulz: Maybe... Maybe this is the last year where your colon is your Valentine, maybe... [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Aw, maybe it'll be... Go bye-bye. Yeah.
Em Schulz: Maybe, maybe it's...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. So then if...
Em Schulz: Time to talk to a doctor. [chuckle]
Christine Schiefer: I made the mistake of being... Of Googling like partial bowel obstruction, uh, treatment, and it's like all these pictures of the surgery and I'm like...
Em Schulz: Oh, that look like [0:07:08.5] ____.
Christine Schiefer: And they have to like resect... Resect your colon... Like they like take it apart and then like staple it back together...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Doesn't that sound like medieval? 'Cause like you...
Em Schulz: You know...
Christine Schiefer: Staple it.
Em Schulz: So, sometimes I, I've been to medical history museums and I'm amazed by...
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: The technology of like yesteryear.
Christine Schiefer: Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: And I'm like, oh, in my mind, this was like super archaic...
Christine Schiefer: Right...
Em Schulz: All the way through.
Christine Schiefer: A staple gun to put your intestines together. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Well, yeah. 'cause then now I look at like today's technology, which I think of as so much more advanced than back then...
Christine Schiefer: It's like robotic.
Em Schulz: And I'm like, oh it's kind of the same. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Right. You think it's all like AI and robots, and then it's like, oh, we just take big staples and, uh...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Just... Cha-chuck, cha-chink, cha-chink. And you're good.
Em Schulz: Well, I get that... I can do that. Just show me... Open up your butt. I can do it.
Christine Schiefer: I could... I'm sure... I'm sure I probably have done that by accident... Umm. Anyway, so I'm okay... I mean, I'm fine. Uh like, I'm, I'm much better than I was two days ago when I thought, this is the end. I told Blaise, this is the end. And he said, you need to stop talking. Go to sleep.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Okay. If you think that again though, you have to go to a hospital, please, you have to go to a hospital.
Christine Schiefer: It's just like, what are they gonna do? You know, they're gonna be like, your friend's...
Em Schulz: They're gonna staple your butt apart or something, so...
Christine Schiefer: I don't want them to staple my butt. I don't.
Em Schulz: I...
Christine Schiefer: I don't.
Em Schulz: I will be there for you when it... When it happens, if it happens. But...
Christine Schiefer: Thank you.
Em Schulz: I... I feel bad. I just feel bad. Okay. Well, let's talk about other people who probably felt really bad.
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: Umm... [laughter] So... By the way, uh, do you drink anything?
Christine Schiefer: Oh yes. Lots of Gatorade. Blaise told me if I hydrate a... 'cause I can't eat. 'cause I can't... I don't have any appetite. So I'm like, I'm just not able to eat but he said if you drink water, make sure it has like something in it, like some salt or some...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: And I said, how about Gatorade? And he said, fine, because then your, your body digests it. It's not just water where it goes like through your... Your stomach is like forced to digest it...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: Which hopefully will help your... My obstruction can get a move on, you know? So all right...
Em Schulz: Yeah. Another quick little cue. Quick little cue...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: What is the plan for next week, when we're supposed to be in Pittsburgh and [0:09:23.8] ____...
Christine Schiefer: Oh. I'll be there. Don't worry.
Em Schulz: Oh my... No, hang on. Umm, like... [laughter] Hang on. Like, may-may-maybe we should reassess. Are you sure?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: We can always push it. We can always...
Christine Schiefer: Oh gosh.
Em Schulz: I know, it's...
Christine Schiefer: No, I'll be fine. It'll go away. It went away last July. It'll go away again. If I have to do surgery, it'll probably be after Pittsburgh anyway, so.
Em Schulz: Okay. Well, you hurry for your first Pittsburgh. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: I'll, I'll just umm, have to get some painkillers. [laughter]
Em Schulz: In... Uh, across international borders in Toronto.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, true. Yeah. That part... Part... I don't know how that works, but, umm...
Em Schulz: You know what, last time you were the homie for me and Eva, and this time, because we had our really severe food... Food poisoning...
Christine Schiefer: Oh that's...
Em Schulz: This time, we got it. We'll bring a little [0:10:10.8] ____...
Christine Schiefer: Honestly, I think I'm in better shape than you... I'm in better shape right now than you two are, 'cause at least I can... I don't have any... Like, I can sit in a... One place. [laughter] So at least there's that. Right? Like...
Em Schulz: That's true.
Christine Schiefer: I feel like I'm winning in that regard, so.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Umm, I I wouldn't... I'm not worried about... I'm not worried about it. Umm, I'm just glad it's not COVID, quite frankly, 'cause it's not contagious. And...
Em Schulz: Hey, me too.
Christine Schiefer: Uh, you know? Yeah. That's it. Living the dream. But I'll be there.
Em Schulz: I... This one originally was gonna have some deep dives to it and they... And it ends up not happening. So I guess that worked out for you. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Oh! [laughter] Excellent.
Em Schulz: A shorter story to endure. Umm, this is a classic whodunit haunting. Umm, this is the...
Christine Schiefer: A who... A classic whodunit haunting.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: A classic.
Em Schulz: I got nothing... No other way to describe it at this point.
Christine Schiefer: If I had a nickel. [laughter]
Em Schulz: So. Uh... [laughter] So this is the haunting of Isabell Binnington. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Ooh. It sounds like we already know whodunit, but...
Em Schulz: It sounds... I mean, uh, she's one of them, for sure. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Okay. Okay.
Em Schulz: So. Uh, there's... This is in Driffield, which is like near Yorkshire in England. Umm, and this is in 1662, so only a couple years back.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Umm, this is, uh, all about Isabell Binnington. She moves there in 1662 with her husband William. And at the time, it was a very small town. It was a very poor town. And we don't know much about their lives, except the fact that Isabell might have been a maid servant...
Christine Schiefer: Mm...
Em Schulz: But that's literally the only o-other information we have, so. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: It is sad. I feel like sometimes I go through like the, umm, Newspapers.com or like the old ancestry records and if somebody was like a cleaner or like a, a "maid" or a servant, that would be like the only record of them...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: I'm like, great. Cool. So there's just nothing... They just don't matter any other way.
Em Schulz: And also, like, sometimes like I, I even look at my own great-great grandparents on the census, and all I know is, yeah, their occupation. And it's such like a vague occupation, where I'm like, I... How was that enough for the government, let alone me, like...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. They're like, oh, that William. Got it.
Em Schulz: One of them just says, candy store. And I'm like, did my grandpa...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, that's actually pretty specific. [laughter]
Em Schulz: I know, but I'm like, were you a candy maker or did you just sell candy...
Christine Schiefer: Were you a candy store?
Em Schulz: Were you a...
Christine Schiefer: Did you have a trench coat filled with turkey pops?
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Were you actually three lollipops stacked on top of each other in a, in a trench coat? [laughter] Umm, I, I... I would like to know more about that. Or others just say like, factory. And I'm like, that can't... [laughter] That can't be all I get to know. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: That can't be right.
Em Schulz: Or even the wives, where it's like homemaker, I'm like, ugh, what a shame. I like, I'm sure there was something... There has to be more to you...
Christine Schiefer: No. Nothing else relevant. No.
Em Schulz: It's all very two-dimensional.
Christine Schiefer: One facet. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Umm, but anyway, so we know she's a maid servant. Great.
Christine Schiefer: Great.
Em Schulz: And we don't even know what he was up to. Umm, so three months after moving in, Isabella notices that there's a spot on the floor that is slightly sunken in. Immediately, I'm gonna go with, why did you only notice three months into this? But okay...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Umm, but she moves in, she notices there's a spot on the floor that's like kind of lower and like a hole had been dug out at some point or there was no foundation under it. Umm, and she thought maybe... I love where her brain goes. This is very Christine. She thinks...
Christine Schiefer: Uh-oh.
Em Schulz: Maybe the former residents buried money or...
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: Valuable items down there. And now it's my job to dig them up and find them.
Christine Schiefer: Well, if you had asked me, "Christine, what would your first thought be?" I would be like, oh, well someone put treasure down there and I'm going to go dig it up. So, yeah.
Em Schulz: So...
Christine Schiefer: That is... Is that not, but like, in all seriousness, is that not where your mind would go?
Em Schulz: No.
Christine Schiefer: What, what would your mind say? Like, I just am wondering what a normal person would think.
Em Schulz: I would say, oh, there was like an issue in construction and now we have to deal with it and get an inspector.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, [laughter] I guess that's smart. Never mind.
Em Schulz: Umm but...
Christine Schiefer: I was like what other more logical reason could there possibly be, Em?
Em Schulz: I mean, it would've been like my second or third thought and I would've been like, I hope that's the case. Instead of me having to pay so much money...
Christine Schiefer: He would've gotten there eventually. Yeah.
Em Schulz: So maybe we do know more about Isabell Binnington. It's that, uh, she ended up reincarnating into Christine Schiefer...
Christine Schiefer: Hey.
Em Schulz: And, had the... The same thoughts are still there. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Giving me her shitty colon issues.
Em Schulz: [chuckle] That... You know, she never mentioned that one historically. So that, that goes unreported, unfortunately.
Christine Schiefer: Bummer.
Em Schulz: Uh, but it'll be very reported for you when you go. That's nice.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, it'll be all I talk about.
Em Schulz: [chuckle] It'll be all, what... Through the Ouija board? What are you talking about? I'm talking about when you're not here anymore.
Christine Schiefer: I don't know, it will be on my census records when they're like, put candy store or factory. I'll be like broken colon...
Em Schulz: Broken stapled butt. Yeah.
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Staples... Staples in butt.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: See, that's another thing where I'd be like...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, that Christine.
Em Schulz: I have to know more. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: See, I love to keep some intrigue alive, you know.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: So, uh, she goes looking through, she starts digging into the middle of her kitchen. Umm, she digs with a knife at first. Love her innovative thoughts here.
Christine Schiefer: That's me also. Butter knife.
Em Schulz: Yeah, it is you, you fucking do everything with a knife, too.
Christine Schiefer: I do dig with a knife. Yeah.
Em Schulz: Ugh. Okay. [laughter] Well, she digs with a knife and then she finds a bunch of staples that were once in someone's butt. I'm just kidding. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Stop it. Is she... [laughter]
Em Schulz: She digs a knife... She's digging with a knife. Because that's not ergonomically friendly to digging, she drops it by accident and it's so far down... Which by the way, how big is this fucking hole? She... It dropped so far down, she can't grab the knife anymore. So it's at least like arm deep, you know?
Christine Schiefer: Oh, I... Well, I wonder if it went through like a floorboard, like it's like a a divot...
Em Schulz: Mm...
Christine Schiefer: Or is it in the floor... Is this, is this hole like in, in dirt or is it in a floor?
Em Schulz: I'm... I'm getting the... I honestly don't know, but I was getting the vibe of dirt.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, okay. And that's...
Em Schulz: Umm, and like the kitchen was on the first floor and there was just a big ass hole that got covered up with floorboards and nothing else.
Christine Schiefer: So she's digging, digging and then she drops it into the hole, you can't reach it. Okay.
Em Schulz: Uh-huh, and she can't get it. So then she takes a, I don't know why she's got this, but it's giving chaos energy. She has a broken piece of plate. [laughter] And...
Christine Schiefer: You know, she took... Well, if it were me, I would take a plate and go, eh, I have enough plates. And smash it and be like, now I've got a lot of shovels.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Or she broke it originally...
Christine Schiefer: Now one man's plate is a woman's 16 shovels. Yep.
Em Schulz: You, you know what? I do think that's the most original statement that has ever been made.
Christine Schiefer: The, uh... [laughter] Thank you.
Em Schulz: I think she just had a, i-in a different way, your trash pile. I bet she had a bunch of broken plates left over...
Christine Schiefer: For sure.
Em Schulz: From something else.
Christine Schiefer: She was like, I'll do something with these one day. And then she's like, take that, mom. I am using that broken plate I saved to dig a hole in the kitchen.
Em Schulz: Is she... Uh, to her husband, it's like, that trash pile was worth keeping. I ended up using something in there.
Christine Schiefer: See? I told you. [laughter]
Em Schulz: So, uh, she ends up grabbing a broken piece of plate to keep digging after she's dropped the knife. And when she... Eventually, she hits something and she gets to burnt broken wooden stakes...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, boy.
Em Schulz: And human bones.
Christine Schiefer: Gasp. Oh my god!
Em Schulz: It's either a scal... Like a head, the top of a head. There might be some teeth in there.
Christine Schiefer: Ugh!
Em Schulz: Those are the only two that we've like documented. But maybe, maybe there's an arm, maybe there's butt. Maybe there's staples on it.
Christine Schiefer: Gasp. If there's not a butt, I'm worried about what happened at the butt.
Em Schulz: I... Yeah, that's true. You know, I went to this museum recently and it had two skeletons in it, and the guy tried to be so slick with it, and he was like, which one do you think is the male body and which one do you think is the female body? And the female body was taller, so he thought he was really gonna get me. And I went...
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: And I guessed them right anyway, not because I have any book smarts, but because I got a lot of street smarts, and I was like, this fucking guy thinks he's gonna trick me, so I'm gonna pick whichever one he thinks...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, that's hilarious.
Em Schulz: So...
Christine Schiefer: And he foiled his own game by being a little too conceited. And he was gonna trick you.
Em Schulz: Yeah. I was like, I... You are acting like a man who wants to prove me wrong, so now I'm just gonna do...
Christine Schiefer: Ha ha.
Em Schulz: The opposite of what you think I'm gonna say. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Was he totally bummed when you got it right?
Em Schulz: Yeah. He was like, yeah, that's right. And I went, well, yeah, don't be an asshole. It's that easy.
Christine Schiefer: I... Don't be an asshole. And also I feel like, that's a stupid thing that, like, I feel like hey, it's a 50/50 chance.
Em Schulz: I should have looked at him and been like, am I a boy or a girl with my skin? You tell me.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah, great question. Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: Oh, you're wrong either way. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: You're wrong. Ha ha.
Em Schulz: Secret third answer.
Christine Schiefer: That would've been a fun little trick question.
Em Schulz: Uh, that would've been real fun. He would've hated it. Anyway. Umm... [laughter] And I was the only person on the tour. It was just him and me, so he really hated it. Umm. So she finds broken wooden stakes and human bones. She thought that maybe the land... This is where like her logic is finally kicking in. She's like, oh, this place was once a burial site, obviously. I don't wanna disturb any bones. Even though I've just dug through them, I don't wanna disturb anything.
Christine Schiefer: With like my fingers.
Em Schulz: Yeah, yeah. And like, like a dirty plate and a, and a knife, you know?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: You just stir them around. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. But I guess now, let's be respectful. I... That's fair...
Em Schulz: Now let's...
Christine Schiefer: That's, that's, that's nice of her.
Em Schulz: I mean, I guess the only thought is that this place must have once been a graveyard, not a body has been buried here after this was a home. But...
Christine Schiefer: You know, it's funny that she thought, oh, someone must have buried a treasure in that hole. And then she finds a dead body...
Em Schulz: Treasure. Geez.
Christine Schiefer: And she's like, well, there's no way a person could have put this here...
Em Schulz: Right, right. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: It must be a graveyard. I'm like, wow. You really flip-flopped on that. [laughter] So at this point, my brain is, uh, this is where I divert from Isabella, and I'm like, oh my god, a serial killer has been in this room.
Em Schulz: Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Well, I wonder if true crime podcasts were popular in the 1600s...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, she would've had a different...
Em Schulz: What... Where would her mind have gone? This is where I like to think in butterfly effect terms, where I'm like, I don't know how beneficial true crime podcasting is these days. I like to think it's brought some awareness to, uh, to some people. I like to think that.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: But in the 1600s or like whenever like Jack the Ripper was going on.
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: If all the like, podcast girlies were covering it, I feel like we might've figured out who he was. You know? Like if we were...
Christine Schiefer: I feel like we would've gotten to the bottom of it, for sure.
Em Schulz: If we were writing in... Especially if they were actual girlies. I feel like we are obviously better than the police in a lot of ways, when it comes to our investigating skills. And I feel like...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. It just seemed like unhinged pathways we take that, umm, may or may not be legal, but probably get some answers.
Em Schulz: We would, at the very least... If there was one person, one woman at the time, who was like writing all your tips to me, like Gossip Girl, about Jack the Ripper...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: We'll find him. We just need to like, we just need to unite.
Christine Schiefer: Band together.
Em Schulz: I don't know, maybe that's an ignorant thing to say. I hope not, but I like to think in the world of Gossip Girl where everything is perfect. So umm...
Christine Schiefer: I mean, I know they had all those... I know that like, it was very sensationalized and so I know they had all those like little penny dreadfuls where they would like write about Jack the Ripper and, and they did sort of try, but you're right, they didn't have like the internet... [laughter]
Em Schulz: I, like, they didn't have, umm, the ability to find others via internet, as...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. It's harder to, to really band together, uh, through like a, a zine.
Em Schulz: Imagine when... First of all, time travel's already real, because if it's, if it's real at any time, it's real. Right?
Christine Schiefer: That's exactly what I always say.
Em Schulz: So when we get to the point where time travel also is within our reach...
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: If ever, uh, imagine if like the Swifties decided, we're going to find Jack the Ripper, we're gonna go kick his ass.
Christine Schiefer: Right. Like, like the way that...
Em Schulz: They can do it.
Christine Schiefer: What happened? Remember when the BTS uh, fan base like took over Twitter...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: For that one, uh, really that like MAGA hashtag that and then like...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: BTS like took over just because, and everyone was like, whoa, that was scary and also like really impressive. But now we're a little bit afraid...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Could happen.
Em Schulz: It's, I'm just saying it's like, uh we'd at least... There would be a department in the time travel crime section, where it's like, we gotta get all these internet sleuths together.
Christine Schiefer: It's time.
Em Schulz: And then go back in time altogether and like do a sting operation, get this guy. Anyway.
Christine Schiefer: It's happening.
Em Schulz: Isabell, are you listening?
Christine Schiefer: Or has it already happened?
Em Schulz: Okay. It has already happened. Just not for us.
Christine Schiefer: Wow.
[vocalization]
Em Schulz: Okay. Isabell finds bones. She thinks obviously, there's a logical reason to this and nothing farfetched...
Christine Schiefer: Mm-mm.
Em Schulz: But then, not too long after this, now that she's disturbed these bones, on August 23rd, 1662, at around 8:30 at night, Isabell is sitting at the hearth, which I almost did a whole deep dive on hearths.
Christine Schiefer: Hearth.
Em Schulz: Hearth? See?
Christine Schiefer: Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: I could have used that deep dive. She's sitting there, she's staying warm and cozy by the fire, and she sees a young blond man, barefoot... What in the world?
Christine Schiefer: Oof. What in the world?
Em Schulz: Dressed in green, which I think is an interesting color. In my mind...
Christine Schiefer: Uh...
Em Schulz: Green wasn't even a fabric choice yet. [laughter] Which I know that's so stupid. Umm, and he's not wearing a hat.
Christine Schiefer: I think they could... I think they could like, use plants to make things green, but I don't know.
Em Schulz: I've literally seen so... I mean, I've seen so many people, even older than 1662, wearing green, but it's still, it takes an extra bump in my brain to realize that it's possible.
Christine Schiefer: You've seen people older than 1662 wearing green, what are you talking about?
Em Schulz: Like, people from earlier than 1662.
Christine Schiefer: Where did you see them?
Em Schulz: Like in... No. I've like, seen... I'm not like, like I've seen pictures of people wearing like Victorian dresses and they're green. It's like I...
Christine Schiefer: Victorian is like 1900.
Em Schulz: Oh, right. 1660... Hmm. What have I seen earlier?
Christine Schiefer: I'm just like, fascinated.
Em Schulz: Maybe my dreams.
Christine Schiefer: By like the fact that you just told us that you time-traveled by accident. Or you accidentally admitted to us that you...
Em Schulz: I, I almost blew my cover. Hang on, hang on...
Christine Schiefer: You... Almost? You literally just outed yourself so actively. What are you doing?
Em Schulz: I feel like I've seen it like, I don't know, in paintings and shit...
Christine Schiefer: Like in a tapestry?
Em Schulz: Like... I get, I've... I feel like I've seen [laughter] archaic outfits and they happened to be green, and I'm like, well, if they're painting them, but then...
Christine Schiefer: I mean, what about Spring-heeled Jack?
Em Schulz: They must have seen it before.
Christine Schiefer: I feel like Spring-heeled Jack wore green. Or maybe I'm making that up.
Em Schulz: I don't know. I don't remember.
Christine Schiefer: [laughter] Okay. Never mind.
Em Schulz: Wait, what's...
Christine Schiefer: I'm trying to help you out here, man.
Em Schulz: I know. It's, uh, I feel like I... Have I not? Whatever. It doesn't matter. She's wear... He's wearing green. And he's barefoot.
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: Right. And he's blond. And he's young. And he's not wearing a hat. So this is where I almost deep dove into the hat etiquette of the 17th century.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah, I was gonna say, there's something about the fact that he's not wearing a hat that must have been relevant.
Em Schulz: I-it was literally documented by one of the, umm, people I talk about later.
Christine Schiefer: Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: They mentioned it in their, umm, like testimony and it's like the most shocking piece of the story to him...
Christine Schiefer: That he's not wearing a hat?
Em Schulz: So he's not wearing a hat. Like he must... Something must be wrong. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Yes. I mean, he's also not wearing shoes. That's like, that's odd even today, uh, for a stranger.
Em Schulz: Interesting that... Well, this was a really poor area, so I'm wondering like...
Christine Schiefer: Oh okay.
Em Schulz: Were shoes optional, but hats weren't?
Christine Schiefer: If you gotta buy one, you gotta buy the hat.
Em Schulz: Which like, I can't even understand that to this day.
Christine Schiefer: That's fucked up.
Em Schulz: But... But apparently, having a hat is everything. I do remember in 1885, umm, when Marty McFly, speaking of time travel, goes back and sees his family, uh, they are shocked he's...
Christine Schiefer: 1885?
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: I thought it was 1985.
Em Schulz: That was Back to the Future 1, Christine.
Christine Schiefer: Oh. Okay. [chuckle]
Em Schulz: Keep it up.
Christine Schiefer: [0:26:33.4] ____.
Em Schulz: In 1885, when he goes to the beginning of his town being built, and he runs into like...
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: The first generation of his family coming to town...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: They are fucking floored that he's not wearing a hat. They're like, you have to have a hat...
Christine Schiefer: Oh for real?
Em Schulz: Like they won't even have a conversation with him until he has a fucking hat on.
Christine Schiefer: Okay. So that explains it then. This is so inappropriate.
Em Schulz: And they were like, poor Irish potato farmers. Like they had a hat.
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: Everyone has hats, apparently.
Christine Schiefer: Everyone had a hat.
Em Schulz: I wonder if I would time travel right now wearing this Boston Red Sox baseball cap, if they'd be like, that's not a hat. Put something else on.
Christine Schiefer: That's, I, I feel like you'd be fine, as long as you went with me who was not wearing a hat, and then you'd be in the clear and I'd be in trouble.
Em Schulz: Okay. Anyway, [chuckle] I thought about doing the etiquette. Uh, it was, believe it or not, incredibly dry text. So I went without. So he's standing there...
Christine Schiefer: I'm sure you can find one of those brochures one day, like in an, uh, antique store where it's like, Hat Etiquette and it has like...
Em Schulz: Ugh!
Christine Schiefer: Diagrams of like how to wear a hat. I love shit like that.
Em Schulz: I love those. There's like the, the book where it's like, How Victorian Children Would Play, and the very first page is Hoop and Stick.
Christine Schiefer: Yes!
Em Schulz: I already know 'cause I own that book. I bought it when I was like in Colonial Williamsburg.
Christine Schiefer: 'Cause you wrote it when you went back in time...
Em Schulz: No. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: I know. [laughter]
Em Schulz: So he's not wearing a hat. He's barefoot. He's in green. He is just standing there. And when I say Isabell's sitting at the fireplace and she sees him, like he appears in her house...
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: Okay.
Christine Schiefer: No shoes, no hat.
Em Schulz: No shoes, no hat. Isabella... Isabell, sorry, uh, thought that he must be a vagabond. Like I love that she's got a reason for everything. [laughter] She's not, no panic, only calm. And she's like, oh, a grown ass man is in my house. Must just be like a vagabond looking for a warm place to sleep. He saw my fireplace. He got really jealous. But before she can address him, he starts moving towards her in complete silence...
Christine Schiefer: Ugh!
Em Schulz: So, now she does... She's no longer Christine and she's now Em Schulz, she just starts shouting like Jesus and Bible verses [laughter] immediately.
Christine Schiefer: Okay. She's...
Em Schulz: As soon as he moves...
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: She's like, hang on a tick. That's not fucking right. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: She was like, god? Com...
[laughter]
Em Schulz: She starts commanding him to speak in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
Christine Schiefer: Ugh.
Em Schulz: Like you better fucking say something. And he does. He tells her that he is a spirit condemned to remain in this house for 21 years.
Christine Schiefer: Oh my!
Em Schulz: Uh, so far, he had been there for 14 years of the 21.
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: Which I like that he's almost telling her like, there is a deadline to this.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Like in seven years, I won't be in your way anymore.
Christine Schiefer: It's like two-thirds of the way through.
Em Schulz: Yes, exactly. I'm like, that's what I would've said to him. I'd be like, you're over halfway there. Don't come near me now. This is... Just...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Just stay where you... Stay under the floor again. Go back.
Em Schulz: Keep your head low. You know, like as low as it was below the...
Christine Schiefer: Be a model inmate.
Em Schulz: Floorboards.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
[chuckle]
Em Schulz: Yeah. So then he, he says this, he's like, oh, I'm a ghost and I'm dead, and I've been here for 14 years. I got another seven to go. Then he just wanders off into the parlor and she lets it happen...
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: I feel like, back to me with my family census, I'm like, hang on, we got more to talk about, all of a sudden. What do you mean you're just gonna walk away? But he just leaves.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. He's a... He's a tease.
Em Schulz: And this is where I wonder what happened in the middle because... So he leaves after he says that, which does feel a little neggy of like...
Christine Schiefer: Yes.
Em Schulz: I, I want you to follow me and ask questions.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Feels attention-seek-y. Then he leaves and then he comes back into the room 15 minutes later.
Christine Schiefer: Oh my god!
Em Schulz: What was he doing for the last 15 minutes? Was he like snooping through her shit or something? I don't know.
Christine Schiefer: Was he like debating whether or not to go back in the room?
Em Schulz: [laughter] It's like, I'm sitting here waiting for her to come follow me...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: So we can talk about this.
Christine Schiefer: He's like me... He... And then he gets too impatient. He's like, ugh, fine, I'll do it.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: So he comes back in to talk to her and he makes it clear that he is harmless. He is kind. He's nice and he promises to never do anything to her.
Christine Schiefer: Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: And also vague. He just says, "You will never want for anything."
Christine Schiefer: Ugh!
Em Schulz: Like because you're here or like, are you pre-predicting the future or...
Christine Schiefer: Right. Ew! Yeah. It... To... I mean, my gut instinct was that he's saying, I'm so nice and I'm so caring and I'll make sure you never want for anything. Like I'll take care of you, which is so icky. Nobody asked for that.
Em Schulz: No... It's like giving Casper romance. It's like, okay, but I didn't ask for this.
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: And also, can you leave my house? It's not yours...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Mostly you're dead.
Em Schulz: So, he's like, yeah, I'm never gonna hurt you.
Christine Schiefer: You're a dead fucking body.
Em Schulz: [laughter] I'm never gonna hurt you. You're chill. I don't mean to like cause any harm. I don't mean to scare you. I just wanted to let you know I'm here. I got seven years to go depending on how long you last. And by the way, you'll never want for anything.
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: Uh, then he just glides away, again probably waiting for her to say something. But he goes away for the rest of the night. The next night, he reappears and she commands him to give her more information, which good for you. Umm.
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: And he says... Oh, oh, oh, remember yesterday when you saw me around 8:30? That was on the anniversary of my death at 8:30 when I died 14 years ago exactly, between 8:00 and 9:00 PM, which is exactly when she saw him.
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: And then, uh, this... I just saved this little quote 'cause it gives me shivers in a, in a weird way. He said, uh, he died between 8:00 and 9:00, 14 years before. And, "I received my grave betwixt 12:00 and 1:00," and then he vanished.
Christine Schiefer: Oh! "Betwixt 12:00 and 1:00."
Em Schulz: I love the use of betwixt.
Christine Schiefer: Ugh! Oof!
Em Schulz: Someone should have a, a little kitty cat, a little black kitty cat named Betwixt. I think that'd be lovely.
Christine Schiefer: I love that. I wonder if that is anyone's cat's name. Tag us. [laughter]
Em Schulz: I wonder if betwixt and Twix candy bars have anything in common.
Christine Schiefer: I thought that as well.
Em Schulz: Hmm. Well...
Christine Schiefer: Hmm.
Em Schulz: So I guess he's saying I died around 8:00 and 9:00. I was buried by 12:00 and 1:00... By 12:00 to 1:00. He appears again later at another time and she says, you have to tell me your name, at the very least. If I'm gonna fucking live with you, you have to tell me who you are. And he says, my name is Robert Eliot.
Christine Schiefer: Ooh!
Em Schulz: And when she says, who killed you? Since you're saying you just died and immediately had a grave, who killed you? He said, "I was knocked in the head in my bed by three women, Mary Burton, Alice Colson the elder, and Anne Harrison." I like how Alice Colson somewhere is like rolling over in her grave. Like, why am I still being called old? Umm...
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. She is like the other two ladies were born same year, but I'm the one [laughter] who gets called out.
Em Schulz: So, Mary Burton, Alice Colson, and Harrison. And Mary Burton seems to be the one he has like the biggest issue with. I think the other two might have just been like friends of Mary Burton's and helped. He was visiting from London, he tells the story to, umm, Isabell. He was visiting from London and he got in a fight with a local woman named Mary Burton, who...
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: Allegedly refused to pay him back when he gave her a loan...
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: Another source that I saw said something about, he was either boarder... Boarding under her or she was boarding with him and there was like a rent issue.
Christine Schiefer: Ooh.
Em Schulz: Umm, but I, I don't really know the details to it, but it sounds like something which would also explain how she had access to him sleeping, if they were staying at the same building.
Christine Schiefer: Right. And also buried him under her own floorboards.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: I think makes probably more sense.
Em Schulz: Which were also his floorboards. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: So one of the versions, uh, or from what he has said, according to Robert Eliot, the ghost, Mary and two of her friends murdered and buried him in the floor to cover it up and nobody ever found out. And after killing him, Mary also stole money from his pockets and pieces of jewelry that were both his mother's and his grandmother's. And she swiped business paperwork, which gave her access to a bunch of his other belongings from his previous home, which she then sold for more money.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, god. She is like really conniving, this Mary.
Em Schulz: She's, yeah. Not someone you wanna mess with.
Christine Schiefer: No.
Em Schulz: Umm, so because Isabell disturbed his bones, that was the first time he had, I guess, he, his spirit was awoken in some way, and because she was responsible for disturbing his bones, she was the only one who could see or hear him. How convenient.
Christine Schiefer: Hmm.
Em Schulz: Over the visits, because he didn't stop not showing up... He didn't stop showing up, which I would've been like, dude, I get it. 14 years, that's super great, but like, you've got seven more and you didn't bother anyone for those other 14. So like, why you gotta bother me?
Christine Schiefer: I was gonna say, like, why is she the, the poor, so... Sap who gets stuck with like, this talker, this yapper, she can't switch seats...
Em Schulz: Yeah. It's like, if anything, because I disturbed your bones and now you're kind of alive here, why don't we just be roommates? But like, we don't have to talk, like.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah, like let's just give each other some space.
Em Schulz: You get this side of the house... Well, anyway, he keeps showing up and he appears in different ways to her sometimes. So like one time, he showed up as a man. One time he showed up as a 12-year-old boy. A lot of times, he showed up in white instead of the green suit he was wearing...
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: Not once do we get any information on the loss of his shoes or hat. And by...
Christine Schiefer: Oh no! [laughter]
Em Schulz: And by the fifth time he visits, umm, he says, he just shows up and like, doesn't even have anything to say to her. So it really is starting to feel like roommates that like...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, finally.
Em Schulz: They just don't even talk to each other. He, she just sees him and goes, that fucker...
Christine Schiefer: They just nod.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Because they like, pass each other for the microwave.
Em Schulz: Exactly. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Umm, another time, he asked her to set fire...
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: To the place where she found the bones AKA her own fucking house. Nothing...
Christine Schiefer: The floor? [laughter] Super.
Em Schulz: The... The floor made of nothing but wood, the kindling.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Great. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Umm, also, by the way, I am... Oh, hang on, maybe we'll get to it... Umm, set fire to the place where she found the bones. And I don't think she did this part, 'cause I never saw it in the story later, but it was a request of his. And he said if it were to happen, "The stake would now be as warm at the root in my heart, as my heart was when the stake was stricken through it."
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: I feel like he's talking in rhymes. I don't care for that.
Christine Schiefer: [0:37:04.7] ____.
Em Schulz: Also, like, I thought he was hit in the head. What hap... Why is he getting stabbed in the heart now?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Maybe he was hit in the head and then they were like, let's just do it for good measure.
Em Schulz: I feel like that eldest one really had like, oh, while he's dead, let's do these other things I've wondered about a body and just like, really... [laughter] And just went for it.
Christine Schiefer: She's like, well, I brought these stakes. And they're like, yeah, we told you not to bring those stakes. So she's like, well, I don't... Uh, I... We have to use them now, I brought them. Ugh...
Em Schulz: It's like, girl, you're overdoing it. Like...
Christine Schiefer: Girl...
Em Schulz: We could get away with it, if it, if he looks like he fell by himself. If we stabbed him through the heart...
Christine Schiefer: Nobody asked you to bring a stake. [laughter]
Em Schulz: It's like, Alice, girl, like, you're a lot...
Christine Schiefer: Alice, like you're so old, I mean...
Em Schulz: Like we knew you would be down for murder but...
[laughter]
Em Schulz: So, uh, let's see. So, at some point in his visits, he tells Isabell that he... Oh, that it was up to her to bring his killers to justice on behalf of him, which keep in mind, he only died 14 years ago, so they might still be alive. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: Oh yeah. And also, like we've learned that, that Mary's not someone you wanna fuck with.
Em Schulz: Yeah. Which by the way, if I were Isabell, I'd be like, uh, until Mary's dead, I'm not touching this, but thank you so much...
Christine Schiefer: Forget it. No, no.
Em Schulz: I just burped into the microphone.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, I missed it.
Em Schulz: Did you hear that?
Christine Schiefer: No, I sure didn't.
Em Schulz: It absolutely happened. Sorry to everybody else. So yeah, if I were, if I had to te... If I had to be told, oh, you're gonna go find justice on my killers now, I'd be like, well, hang on a second, I'm not involved in this. I know I just stripped the bones. I'm so sorry about that...
Christine Schiefer: [0:38:37.4] ____ I'm so sorry. I cannot express how sorry... [laughter]
Em Schulz: It's like... It's like, I know that you have it in your head now that I have to do something about this...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, god...
Em Schulz: But like, I, I didn't request that.
Christine Schiefer: No.
Em Schulz: Umm, also, where the hell is her husband? Like why isn't she a... Talking about this stuff with him?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Where, where, why is it not his fucking problem?
Em Schulz: Uh-huh. So anyway, he... The husband never gets mentioned, which is bananas to me. Uh, the guy, Robert, right? Uh, he decides, well, you are responsible. I don't make the rules. And somehow convinces her and she's now like dead set to help him, which like, that couldn't have gone any better for him because he would've gotten a different answer out of me.
Christine Schiefer: He must be a fucking charmer, that barefoot bastard. He is like...
Em Schulz: He's...
Christine Schiefer: I know, I know. I'll just tell her to go, uh, avenge my death. Oh, it worked.
Em Schulz: I'm fancy enough for a green suit, but a hat? Forget it.
Christine Schiefer: A hat? Come on.
Em Schulz: He started giving her details about his life to help prove his existence and eager to help, uh, Isabell contacts a local magistrate's office and reports the murder, and then tells them everything, including that there's a ghost manifesting in front of her.
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: However, can you believe that the officials were skeptical? If I worked in that department, I'd be like, I'm taking my lunch break right now and going over to your house to see this guy.
Christine Schiefer: I was gonna say, you and I would be like, finally, I like my job for a minute. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah. So, Isabell tells them that... Uh, tells the ghost that night, says, hey Robert, I need more information because people still aren't believing what's going on. And keep in mind, it was a difficult time for ghost stories because this was during the reformation. And so, a lot of people were moving away from Catholicism...
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: And thus like purgatory and trapped souls. And so like, his story kind of went against what people were moving from.
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: Umm, others still believe in it though. It was like a, it was a weird gray space. So some people were into it, some people weren't. And Isabell knew someone would eventually listen if she had all the information. So she got more information from Robert, spread it through town and she even demanded at churches of all types for ghosts to, uh, for the ghosts to be included in their prayers. Like start praying for Robert. Homegirl had nothing to do. I mean, remember like on the census, it would've just said housewife, which like...
Christine Schiefer: I thought that like she was...
Em Schulz: Now I'm like, what the hell was my grandma up to? She could have been up to something like this.
Christine Schiefer: Oh my god. Imagine the things she discovered in that candy store.
Em Schulz: I know! [chuckle]
Christine Schiefer: The ghostly apparitions that came through the floor. But what about... Okay, quick question. Didn't her census say, did it say housewife or did it say like ser... Maid or something?
Em Schulz: We think it was maid servant, from one source.
Christine Schiefer: It's like they're fucking busy, like they're...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: That's like hard labor, basically. So if she's around scrubbing floors and stuff, how does she have time to go on like a jaunt? Maybe it was like her, her, her, like how we did the podcast 'cause we needed like an outlet, like a, like a hobby after work. Maybe this is like her passion project, you know.
Em Schulz: It's gotta be. She sounds way too passionate about it.
Christine Schiefer: Like her side hustle.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Yeah.
Em Schulz: Side hustle. She, uh, she is taking it a little seriously for a side hustle though. I mean, she's literally contacting authorities and churches, and raising issues all over the, the public space, the, the community...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah, 'cause she's a boss babe.
Em Schulz: You know what? May-maybe that's the way I need to look at it. [laughter] Even still, people refused to pay attention to her until Robert himself gave Isabell more information that could seriously stick. And he said, you know what? Not only do I have information about myself, I have information about others...
Christine Schiefer: Gasp.
Em Schulz: And let's just say, I know of a secret plot to kill the king.
Christine Schiefer: Oh. [laughter] That's not an escalation at all.
Em Schulz: He really went for the throat there. He said, I know two men working for the king...
Christine Schiefer: Holy shit.
Em Schulz: Who work u-under him in the castle and they are going to kill him. And he even gave Isabell their full names and positions.
Christine Schiefer: He like pulled his trump card so fast, I feel like.
Em Schulz: He was like, if no one's gonna listen to me, they'll listen to this and then maybe they'll pay attention to me...
Christine Schiefer: Wow!
Em Schulz: And then I'll get help.
Christine Schiefer: So, wow. So he's... So now she's in like, I would argue, a pretty dangerous fucking position.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: They're like, uh, she has like, names of people in the court that she is gonna accuse...
Em Schulz: All of a sudden, she's absolutely like an accomplice or something.
Christine Schiefer: Ugh. Yeah. It feels like she's gonna be in some hot water for this, but...
Em Schulz: Or what's the, what's the, the, the law when it's like conspiracy or something, where it's like you're not totally involved, but you know of something?
Christine Schiefer: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah...
Em Schulz: I don't know.
Christine Schiefer: A conspirator? I don't know.
Em Schulz: Something.
Christine Schiefer: No...
Em Schulz: Umm.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, it's like where you... I forget, I know the word... [laughter] Eva!
Em Schulz: She's now officially like... She's now officially responsible in some way, at least. Umm, which by the way, let's talk again. This man is a ghost and in 1660s, we don't... We don't know how accurate of a story this is. It could be, you know, she's going through something and she has created a side character and...
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: If that's the case, she just made up an assassination plot like...
Christine Schiefer: That... See, that's pretty alarming. Yeah. Yeah, 'cause that came from her own head.
Em Schulz: Like seeing people, hearing things that nobody else can, and now the king will be killed. That's fucking crazy, too.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Yeah.
Em Schulz: Umm, so this was in, like I said, 1662. This was not a time when Isabell, by the way, could have gotten access to the names of people and their positions who worked under the king.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, okay. I was gonna ask if that was just like public knowledge.
Em Schulz: I don't think it was.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, weird. Okay.
Em Schulz: Umm, but she did know it would be a father or the, the ghost, Robert, knew it would be a father-son duo with the last name Jenkins. And fun fact, in like 2024 research, there is, there was at the time, a Robert and Phillip Jenkins that worked...
Christine Schiefer: Gasp.
Em Schulz: In the royal household at the time.
Christine Schiefer: Ooh.
Em Schulz: So it's weird that she knew that, when like, she wouldn't have had access to that information, unless maybe she knew a guy who knew a guy. You know? It...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Like she'd heard about the name Jenkins and was like, oh, you know. [0:44:52.7] ____.
Em Schulz: Uh-huh. Or like, oh, I've got a friend and his dad, they both work at the castle. We're not supposed to know about that. And like, she's overheard it at the bar, you know?
Christine Schiefer: Right. Right, right, right.
Em Schulz: Like, I like to think living in Hollywood, sometimes I like to play the game of like, how many degrees away am I from an Avenger? [laughter] And shockingly, I'm only like one degree away from a few though, which is so cool.
Christine Schiefer: Well, it's not that shocking. It's not that shocking.
Em Schulz: It is to me, it's shocking to me.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. But like... But you've like actively manifested that, and you live in Burbank, California, you know.
Em Schulz: That's true. [laughter] One of them is always like within 15 minutes of me...
Christine Schiefer: No, like it's very impressive, but don't sell yourself short.
Em Schulz: Oh, thank you.
Christine Schiefer: Like, I would've thought you're negative degrees by this point, away.
Em Schulz: Well, I, no, I've, I've yet to hang out one-on-one with a, with an Avenger. But I like to think in 1662, this is what other people dreaming of like, how many degrees am I away from someone who works for the royal family?
Christine Schiefer: From the jester. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah. Like how many, like, just the jester. Only him. That's all we need.
Christine Schiefer: What about like, what if the... Like you made out with the jester in high school and you're like, oh, and now he's a jester, so I guess that makes me one degree away from the king? [laughter]
Em Schulz: I love that idea, because it's like, what does that make you, if your connection to the castle is you made out with the town idiot or whatever?
Christine Schiefer: It makes... Why, [chuckle] why is it like me, the one who's making my own story, who's like I made out with the jester in high school. Like I couldn't even just say like, I made out with like the prince... [laughter]
Em Schulz: The chef... Oh yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Or like the jester. I don't know.
Em Schulz: The king himself. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: That's just how... That's what I, I guess that's... Speaks to my own self, uh, self-worth. And I stand by it 'cause I feel like the jester is, you know, always the one who got to make fun of the king.
Em Schulz: You know, Kate Middleton when it was like back in the early 2000s and she was dating Prince William...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: You know, that she... Her friends were thinking like, even if they don't get together, she gets to say that she made out with the future king. Like how cool. It might though...
Christine Schiefer: Right? I mean, it's still a cool story.
Em Schulz: Yeah. It's so cool.
Christine Schiefer: Also is the word we were looking for an accessory?
Em Schulz: Accessory.
Christine Schiefer: Like where, you know about it. But... I mean, I just didn't want people to start tweeting and be like, guys, you never figured that out, 'cause I think, I think that's what we were trying to say, an accessory where you're aware of it, but you didn't do anything.
Em Schulz: Yeah, I think that's right. So, she says there's this father-son duo with the last name Jenkins. They're gonna kill the king. They work for the royal family. And there was, in fact, two people there at the time who worked, you know... So it's, it's interesting that she did know that.
Christine Schiefer: It is.
Em Schulz: But we don't know how. It is possible that the ghost and/or Isabell, uh, made this up to get authorities' attention because they weren't getting the attention yet, even though they were trying, so maybe they created this murder for them to investigate, just to like, kind of ruffle some feathers...
Christine Schiefer: Get on their radar... Yeah.
Em Schulz: And get, and get them talking. But maybe it was real, we don't know. Officials couldn't ignore the fact that a potential assassination attempt on the king was being thrown around, so.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Uh, through that, Isabell continued to advocate for the ghost, being like, and when you're done with that, don't forget about this.
Christine Schiefer: About my ghost friend?
Em Schulz: About my ghost friend who wants justice for the murderers. I don't, I still feel like the ghost story is more interesting. Sorry to the king.
Christine Schiefer: I do, too. And also... I do, too. No offense to the king. [chuckle] Uh, but also like, what did they expect? If this is just a plot or a ploy to get attention, they're not gonna care about Robert's murder anymore.
Em Schulz: Yeah, exactly.
Christine Schiefer: If they're just focused on the king's murder, like, they're gonna be like, who cares about this dead guy? He's already dead. Like, I feel like she kind of did the angle wrong. Like, if she's like, oh, the king's gonna get murdered. Like, they're not gonna get any more fucking attention.
Em Schulz: I 1000% agree of like, she, her strategy was not right.
Christine Schiefer: She shot too far. You know, now that they're gonna be looking over there.
Em Schulz: Yeah. You gotta pick something that's kind of gradually nearby so that way, they...
Christine Schiefer: Right. Right. Keep it...
Em Schulz: They have a mutual interest.
Christine Schiefer: Keep the interest piqued.
Em Schulz: It was soon clear that Isabell was not going to give up until someone listened to her. And locals finally umm, heard her out in an official forum. I think they were like, let's just shut this fucking woman up. [laughter] I'm so tired of it. Now we've got a whole assassination plan that we wanna hear about...
Christine Schiefer: And she's like, thank you. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Honestly, uh maybe that was her, that was her tactic of like, let me just start pestering like the high...
Christine Schiefer: I just like, won't stop. [laughter]
Em Schulz: The high authorities until everyone's annoyed and they just wanna shut me up.
Christine Schiefer: Good for her. [laughter]
Em Schulz: So now, this is a month later. This is September 1662. And Isabell, under oath, before two justices, one who was also a knight, she told the whole story again and included the ghost name Robert Eliot, the city he was from, his birthday, his parents' names, his sisters' names, where his sisters live today.
Christine Schiefer: Geez.
Em Schulz: Umm, all the information that Robert had given her.
Christine Schiefer: Couldn't she go find his sisters or were they really far away?
Em Schulz: So they were... He... His sisters' names were Kate and Jane, and those sisters were still alive, which is weird though, like if she was just like mentally ill and coming up with this stuff, it's, uh, uh, I mean...
Christine Schiefer: Actual... Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Em Schulz: It matched. He... She could have also been mentally ill and just picking like random people she'd heard about in town, you know, so...
Christine Schiefer: Right. True. True.
Em Schulz: This is just...
Christine Schiefer: But then they would've had to have a brother who died.
Em Schulz: Right. Yeah. Again, maybe she's just going to a really popular gossip bar and they're like, I know a guy, his name is Robert. He's dead.
Christine Schiefer: Maybe she's a maid servant and she's scrubbing floors, and everyone's ignoring her, but she's just getting all the hot goss from her, from her boss. You know.
Em Schulz: This is just like, is to... Uh, yes. That's gotta be... I... I... If that's not it, I want that to be so bad... This is just like...
Christine Schiefer: I've seen Downton Abbey.
Em Schulz: This is just a dark tale of like, when you don't pay attention to the little people who are listening...
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: They got all the intel. Yup.
Christine Schiefer: They've got ears. They've got ears everywhere.
Em Schulz: So the sisters were alive and Isabell could even tell the justices where they lived and what church they go to these days. And she was able to also say where Robert's parents were born, what his dad did for a living, where his dad currently was...
Christine Schiefer: Geez.
Em Schulz: And she was questioned on, at least separate, eight separate occasions. And she continued to demand an investigation for Robert. I wonder if she even gave a shit about Robert or if she was just like, please, this is the only way I can get this ghost out of my house. Please exorcise this house for me.
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I remember the... There was a specific sentence you said earlier, which was eager to help.
Em Schulz: Yes.
Christine Schiefer: And I was like, was she eager to help or was she just eager to get this fucking guy away? Umm, so.
Em Schulz: Yeah. I, I think that's what... I mean, unless she really had nothing else going on and she needed a hobby, it sounds to me like she's just willing to do whatever it takes... She just got this house... Ugh.
Christine Schiefer: Maybe... Right. Like she... Go ahead, get him out of here. And I, I mean, it sounds like the start of a dramedy where like, oh, guess I'm now suddenly involved in this crime. And...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: Laughs ensue. Hilarity ensues.
Em Schulz: Laugh... Hysterics, hilarity ensues.
Christine Schiefer: Yep. Yep.
Em Schulz: Umm, the media finally begins to pick up the story. One pamphlet reads, from the time, 'cause you know, I fucking love reading an old pamphlet and telling you...
Christine Schiefer: Pamphlet.
Em Schulz: How many words were in one run-on sentence of a header.
Christine Schiefer: I can't wait. [laughter]
Em Schulz: You wanna guess how many words were in the headline alone?
Christine Schiefer: The headline. Oh, uh, eight.
Em Schulz: 71.
Christine Schiefer: What? Sorry. That was so loud! [laughter] 71?
Em Schulz: [laughter] This is the head... This is... Oh, the, the pamphlet, uh, reads, "A Strange and wonderfull discovery of a horrid and cruel murther committed 14 years since upon the person of Robert Eliot, of London, at Great Driffield in the East-Riding of the County of York: Discovered in September last by the frequent apparitions of a spirit in several shapes and habits unto Isabell Binnington, the wife of William Binnington, the now inhabitants in the house where this most execrable murder was committed."
Christine Schiefer: Execrable? [laughter]
Em Schulz: E-X-E-C-R-A-B-L-E. Execrable.
Christine Schiefer: Execrable?
Em Schulz: Ex... [laughter] I don't fucking know, this murder was committed. So...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, execra-execrable.
Em Schulz: Execrable. I've never heard that word in my life.
Christine Schiefer: Me neither.
Em Schulz: Anyway, that it's... The fact, I feel like when we were younger and they were trying to teach us like how to write an essay, they... I don't know about you, but I was taught that like do five paragraphs or five sentences...
Christine Schiefer: Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: If you're doing a short answer of the who, what, when, where, why, and how. So maybe six.
Christine Schiefer: Hmm.
Em Schulz: Who, what, when, where, why, how. Yeah. The five Ws and then how. I feel like they just answered all that in the headline and now I don't need to read the fucking story. Like what else are you going to tell me?
Christine Schiefer: It's like, nowadays, when you say like, oh, I just looked at the headline, it doesn't... It means you like don't know anything about it. But now, with this, it's like, oh, I looked at the headline. Oh, well, tell me everything. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah. No wonder everyone was able to read the entire paper every day. They just... It'd be like, just... It was just a bunch of sentences... Just a bunch of headlines.
Christine Schiefer: It's like three stories. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Three headlines.
Em Schulz: Nowadays the headline is to hook you for the rest of it. But...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. This one, I don't know what they were doing, just word vomiting.
Em Schulz: Uh, the printed stories began to get even more detailed. I can't imagine anything more detailed when that headline is 71 years... 71 words long. But... [laughter] Okay, so the printed stories get even more detailed. Whether they were real stories from Isabell herself, whether they were stories confabulated by the ghost or maybe they were just journalists who were embellishing for the readers, we don't know, but the stories got more specific. One story's...
Christine Schiefer: I mean...
Em Schulz: What?
Christine Schiefer: Just no offense, but like, we don't know if they were embellishing. I mean, read that fucking headline, like the words... It... Inexecrable, whatever the fuck, like Jesus Christ. They probably wrote...
Em Schulz: It...
Christine Schiefer: Imagine the fucking article about... Like they would've used like 95 words to describe like the green suit he was wearing.
Em Schulz: Yes, yes.
Christine Schiefer: And it would've all just been made up, so that they could write more words.
Em Schulz: Interesting they never mentioned his hat, so maybe it wasn't that grabby. You know?
Christine Schiefer: Interesting, Em...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm. That should be...
Christine Schiefer: Maybe that was the... Maybe that was the meat of the story, and they're like, you won't know the real hot gossip until you start reading the article...
Em Schulz: They're like... And get this...
Christine Schiefer: Get this.
Em Schulz: This fucking guy. No hat.
Christine Schiefer: If you got past the headline...
Em Schulz: No hat.
Christine Schiefer: You get the juicy stuff.
Em Schulz: He came back to earth, forgot his hat.
Christine Schiefer: Came back to earth. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah, so I think it's probably a combination of em-embellishing... E-embellished journalists, plus the ramblings of either a mentally unstable and/or incredibly attention-needy woman.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Who happens to know a lot of people in town or whatever.
Christine Schiefer: And also like has bad things to say about most of them, so.
Em Schulz: Yeah. [laughter] So one story actually went, this is... Like oh do we... Is it embellished or was it fro... Told by the ghost? One story, for example, is that Mary Burton, Robert's killer, Ro... Just before killing him, told Robert, "I could find in my heart to drink thy blood as freely as this cup of Ale."
Christine Schiefer: Jesus!
Em Schulz: So, homegirl literally said, I want to fucking drink your blood because I care that little about you.
Christine Schiefer: Allegedly.
Em Schulz: Allegedly. Uh, despite Isabell's determination, ultimately the investigation came up empty. I'm sorry...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: But were there or not literal bones in her house? I feel like that should have at least brought an investigator in, but whatever. Umm, public arguments against the story stated that they couldn't find records of all three women involved in the killing. They were only able to find records of one of the murderers. I think it was Mary, umm, and she was now dead, so they couldn't even be questioned, and so you couldn't rightfully, you know, announce or state that this was a a real crime.
Christine Schiefer: And so, basically, she did wait for Mary to be dead before...
Em Schulz: She did. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Uh, this kind of went down. Yeah, yeah.
Em Schulz: Which like, if if homeboy is stuck in the house, if this ghost knows about a random assassination plot, which we never even covered that, how does he know that? Who is he talking to?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. [laughter] Earlier when you said, like now we know that there was a Jenkins. I'm like, wait, are you, why are you saying it like we're never going to discuss this again? And then it like, never, never came up.
Em Schulz: He... If he knows that there's an assassination plot on the other side, uh, of, I don't know where Yorkshire is, somewhere in England, he knows a whole other storyline going on, he couldn't tell you if Mary was alive or not? Why did we go on this goose chase?
Christine Schiefer: I mean, I wish I knew, but I... [laughter]
Em Schulz: I don't know.
Christine Schiefer: I can't for the life of me understand what's happening.
Em Schulz: They... [chuckle] So uh they were only able... Basically, the courts were like, we can't go any further. They were only able to find records of Mary, but they don't know if that was actually... You know, they were never able to question her. On top of that, one of the justices publicly criticized the testimony, which didn't help, but people wonder...
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: If that's because the justice was, you know, which side of the reformation was he on? Maybe he didn't like want to believe in trapped souls.
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: We don't know if that was part of the reasoning. Or that the story was fucking ridiculous. I don't know. There was no official investigation later into Robert's death or a, a trial. The investigation that did happen was more of like a credibility trial about Isabell before they went any further.
Christine Schiefer: Sure.
Em Schulz: And if they, if there were any more records about the, umm, about Robert or Isabell's attempts to get him justice, they're now lost to time.
Christine Schiefer: Wow.
Em Schulz: But we can end on a high note that according to Robert, he was only going to be around for seven more years. So by 1670, he has passed and he is no longer with us. But...
Christine Schiefer: Wow.
Em Schulz: And that is, uh, the haunting of Isabell Binnington.
Christine Schiefer: That's so wild.
Em Schulz: Thank you.
Christine Schiefer: I... The, the fact that he was like, [chuckle] oh, well, I've got seven years left. I guess, now's the time to go on this...
Em Schulz: No.
Christine Schiefer: Like crusade to avenge my death. And it's like, you're two-thirds of the way there. Just...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Go back... Take another nap and you'll be in heaven or whatever.
Em Schulz: Well, it's like... [laughter] That's what you say to like grandpa, like take one more nap and you'll be in heaven. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: That's what I say to you, every time you come over. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Every time I take a nap at... Especially at your house, there's something intoxicating about your house.
Christine Schiefer: I know.
Em Schulz: Every time I take a nap, I do think I... I don't know if I'm going to heaven, but I'm certainly not on earth. I'm...
Christine Schiefer: You're... [laughter]
Em Schulz: There is a... There is a purgatory I can't escape from all the way.
Christine Schiefer: Your... Your husk... You're leaving your husk behind, heading somewhere in the ethos.
Em Schulz: You know the dreams where it feels like g-force is holding you back in a rollercoaster, like to, to like pull yourself back into reality? I... Those are the naps I have when I'm at your house, where I just feel like...
Christine Schiefer: I never had that feeling.
Em Schulz: What?
Christine Schiefer: Okay. So you texted me the other day, and you and I had both had really bad and weird dreams, and you were like, yeah, I was trying to pull... It was one of those where I was trying to pull myself back. And I was like, I've never had that.
Em Schulz: That happens to me all the time.
Christine Schiefer: But I'm, I like, so...
Em Schulz: That's insane.
Christine Schiefer: Does that mean you're like lucid dreaming? Like you know you're dreaming?
Em Schulz: Does it mean that I'm dying and trying to come back to earth? [laughter] I have no idea what that means, but I... It feels like... You've never had one of those dreams where you wake up...
Christine Schiefer: No.
Em Schulz: And you're like, what year is it? Like you've never...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, I mean, yeah, but not, like, I don't know what happened right before I woke up. Like, I don't...
Em Schulz: Oh, maybe I am lucid... I, I don't know. I really...
Christine Schiefer: Like, like... So are you in a dream and you're like, I've gotta get out of here?
Em Schulz: No. I'm like... It's like, if Allison's, like, it's like I'm in such a deep sleep, I can't wake up, but like, I'm trying 'cause I...
Christine Schiefer: Oh. You're like trying to pull your consciousness out?
Em Schulz: Yes. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, I see. I guess maybe I've done that.
Em Schulz: 'Cause like... Like like Allison's trying to wake me up and be like, hey, dinner's here or something. But I'm so, I'm so deep in like my...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, you're like fighting the abyss. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yes. Fighting the abyss is the exact way to put it.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Okay. Okay.
Em Schulz: I, I often call, whenever I'm asleep, 'cause I don't know where I'm going, I'm, I'm not here. That's, I'm not present. Umm...
Christine Schiefer: We... We've determined that. [laughter]
Em Schulz: I usually call like dreamworld specifically, but really the abyss of sleep, I just call it the beyond. And so a lot of times...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm heading to the beyond. Yeah. Yeah.
Em Schulz: When I, when I tell Allison I'm going to bed, I'm like, oh, I'm gonna go to the beyond for a little bit. Will I meet you there? Am I gonna see you? Where are we gonna... Like, we... Sometimes we'll plan in advance, which I guess is our own like, special way of like, trying to like, like lucid dream or...
Christine Schiefer: I mean, yeah.
Em Schulz: Because...
Christine Schiefer: It sounds like...
Em Schulz: I heard it... Uh, it's really meant to just be like a sweet little, like, inside joke of like, oh, I'm gonna go get ice cream in the beyond. Am I gonna see you at the ice cream parlor?
Christine Schiefer: And then all of a sudden, you're like, which pillar are we meeting at?
Em Schulz: Yeah. It's like, is time a thing there? Or else, I'm gonna be waiting forever. Like, what's...
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: I'm late. Are you late?
Em Schulz: Umm. Anyway, so yeah, no, pulling myself back from the beyond, it feels like... I I don't know what else to say. It really...
Christine Schiefer: I know what you mean...
Em Schulz: It... Whatever you just said, that... That's it.
Christine Schiefer: I, I've, I've done that. I feel like I thought you meant you were in a dream and you were like, shit, I've gotta get out of here. And you were like trying to like pinch yourself awake out of like an active dream.
Em Schulz: Oh, no. That's sleep paralysis. [laughter] I have also done that.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. That's like lucid dreaming or sleep paralysis, but yes. Umm, wow. Okay. Fascinating. Uh...
Em Schulz: Thank you. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: All right. So today I have for you, I'm gonna call this the Sharron Prior previously cold case.
Em Schulz: Ooh, okay. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: Yes. Okay. So we're gonna cover Sharron Prior today. This one fucking sucks...
Em Schulz: All right. I don't know who that is.
Christine Schiefer: Well, it's just sad and bad.
Em Schulz: Oh, okay.
Christine Schiefer: Yay. Sharron Kim Prior was born in February 1959 and grew up in the Pointe-Sainte-Charles neighborhood of Montreal in... Do you know where?
Em Schulz: Quebec.
Christine Schiefer: Yay!
Em Schulz: Okay.
Christine Schiefer: Those who knew her described her as a bright young girl. You know, all the usual things that make it extra sad. She lit up a room. She had a zest for life.
Em Schulz: Mm.
Christine Schiefer: Uh she lived with her mother, Yvonne, her two younger sisters who are twins, and their names were Moreen and Doreen. Umm...
Em Schulz: Love that.
Christine Schiefer: And I also love it because Doreen is spelled like D-O-R-E-E-N and Moreen is spelled M-O-R-E-E-N. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm. Oh, that's fun.
Christine Schiefer: I know.
Em Schulz: It would've been extra horrible if it was Moreen spelled like Doreen and Doreen spelled like Moreen.
Christine Schiefer: Doreen. Yeah, that would be... You're right. [laughter] That would've been so much worse.
Em Schulz: Oof. What a cruel joke!
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: That would've been worse. Umm, I gotta, I gotta get... Hand it to them. They picked the right, right option.
Em Schulz: If you... If you ever had twins, did you ever have like a twin set of names...
Christine Schiefer: You know, like...
Em Schulz: Which I know there's like, I... Some people also obviously opt to like, hey, they're their own individual people, so maybe we give them individual names, but in a fun little, like, we're writing up cartoons and the twins have to have names...
Christine Schiefer: Fantasy world.
Em Schulz: What would you pick?
Christine Schiefer: Phil and Lil. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah. Uh, that one's I think done.
Christine Schiefer: That one's been taken. Umm you know, not really. I feel like I always thought about it in like, real world terms, but not in like twin name, twin match names. What were yours?
Em Schulz: I always, uh, at the time, I will say it again. It was before they were popular and I got made fun of all the way through because everyone said they were ugly names, and now everyone needs to shut their little mouths. [laughter] I always wanted... I mean it.
Christine Schiefer: Okay. No...
Em Schulz: I'm so upset because I got bullied so hard for these names and now they're popular. And I'm like...
Christine Schiefer: I know, I know. Uh we've discussed this because I...
Em Schulz: Okay.
Christine Schiefer: I remember when you first told me, you were like, this is probably weird. And I was like, I think those are great names. And then all of a sudden, they like boomed in popularity.
Em Schulz: Yes. And now I can't use them 'cause then I just feel, I just look like I'm like following the pack. But uh I always...
Christine Schiefer: And also because your kids are gonna kill you 'cause every time, you're gonna be like, but I actually got bullied for liking that name...
Em Schulz: I know. I know.
Christine Schiefer: When I was in middle school. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Umm, I always wanted, if I had two people who would want more masc names, at the time, I... It was always like, oh, if I had twins, I think they'd be twin boys, I would go with Oliver and Owen, because I like the O...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, we just talked about this...
Em Schulz: The same letter theme.
Christine Schiefer: I... Those are both great names.
Em Schulz: Thank you. I think so. Umm and now, I don't know, 'cause I al... I always am so flaky about whether or not I even want kids. Some days, I'm like, oh, maybe in a few years. And then there's other times where I'm like, absolutely not. So...
Christine Schiefer: Me, too.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: I, I'm... Well, uh-oh. Uh... [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Heads up. That doesn't go away. No. [laughter] I'm just kidding.
Em Schulz: Uh but I, I feel like baby names for me are like shifting a lot 'cause I'm like, oh, if it's not that serious, and like, I'm not actually thinking about having kids, and like, what's the most ridiculous name I could come up with that actually sounds dope? And I was, I like recently fell into like space-themed names...
Christine Schiefer: Whoa.
Em Schulz: For babies. And I was like, oh, that's kind of fun. Anyway, I've been going down a baby name trail recently...
Christine Schiefer: Xenon?
Em Schulz: Not Xenon. [laughter] Although that could be one. Uh, I don't know why that's not on the list, but it's like Nebula and Cosmo and Echo and...
Christine Schiefer: Ooh! [laughter]
Em Schulz: I was like they're a little too far-fetched but I appreciate the effort. I think Echo's kind of a dope name for like a non-binary person.
Christine Schiefer: That's a great name... I've I've I've met a few young Cosmo... I've seen Cosmo.
Em Schulz: See, I don't, I don't like the name Cosmo, but I love the sound of the word Cosmos, so, I don't, I don't know where I stand, like as a name, all of a sudden, it doesn't feel right.
Christine Schiefer: You could do Osmosis Jones.
Em Schulz: Oh. That... We're still scientific, aren't we, in that way?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: If you, what's a name that you did not use for Leona that you will never use that like you can say...
Christine Schiefer: Uh-huh.
Em Schulz: And not risk using it later?
Christine Schiefer: Hmm.
Em Schulz: Like are there names where you're like, oh, well that one's not gonna get used anymore?
Christine Schiefer: Oh... Well, I always really liked the name Elliott. Uh, but now...
Em Schulz: That's a good one...
Christine Schiefer: Leona's cousin is named Elliott...
Em Schulz: That's also been really popular right now. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. So, we have family with that name now. So, but no, I don't know. No-nothing, there are a couple that are still up, up for play, I don't know if that's a sentence... If that's a word, but umm, you know, if we have another, so I'm like, I don't know if there's any that are completely off the table yet.
Em Schulz: I always... I always loved the names Lucy and Kimberly, which is like, so...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: I guess early '90s now, but like... I...
Christine Schiefer: Very. It sounds like Baby-Sitters Club.
Em Schulz: I know it's like Kimmy, but also I think Kimmy was from the Pink Power Ranger.
Christine Schiefer: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Em Schulz: And I'd always liked the name Lucy, I don't know why, that always got me...
Christine Schiefer: I think it's a pretty... A very pretty name.
Em Schulz: But nobody I've ever dated, nobody I've ever dated has been in agreement with me and has liked those names. So there are names that I'm pretty sure.
Christine Schiefer: Mm.
Em Schulz: Are never gonna get used if I even have kids, but they are names that I've always had at the top of my list.
Christine Schiefer: Well, if something really radical happens, I like the name, so set me up. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Okay. Leona, Lucy would be precious.
Christine Schiefer: Oh wait, that's actually really cute. Leona, Lucy, and Lemon. The perfect little trio.
Em Schulz: Oh shut the fuck up about that one. But I don't know, right?
Christine Schiefer: Wait. But I would love if you had a little Lucy and then it would be Leona and Lucy. I think that's very cute. Umm...
Em Schulz: I know. I think that'd be... And also, like, I feel like Lucy... I try to think of names now where I'm like, if my kid is gender non-conforming in some way or wanna transition...
Christine Schiefer: Oh yeah.
Em Schulz: I kind of wanna still like, be like sticky and control, and be like, ooh. But if I pick a name that like is already gender-neutral, then like, you don't have to change your name.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: They could still change their name, but I like to feel like, oh, maybe I can play the game with you. You know?
Christine Schiefer: Well I tried to do that with Leona 'cause I was like, then if she feels like it's too feminine, you could go by Leo. You know.
Em Schulz: Yeah, exactly.
Christine Schiefer: If, if you feel like you need a change.
Em Schulz: Yeah. With Lucy, I feel like the best you can do is just switch it over to like a Lucas or to Luke or something. Or Lou.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, I thought you were about to tell me like, that's why you like Lucy. And I was like, my friend, I I would argue that one... [laughter]
Em Schulz: I, no, I would... Like the name...
Christine Schiefer: What about Lucifer?
Em Schulz: Oh, actually, you know, he gets a bad rap, so...
Christine Schiefer: He does, I wonder why. It's so weird.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: You know if Lucy decided, hey, I'm transitioning, my name is now Lucifer. I'd be like, that's fucking [laughter] badass. That's so cool.
Christine Schiefer: Imagine like Fox News and when they get their fucking filthy paws on that story, they'd be like, an 8-year-old... [laughter]
Em Schulz: I mean, that's how I feel about kids named Damien. I'm like, ooh, that was a, a bold call.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Or Lilith, which is like one of the most beautiful names, but like is for the woman who...
Em Schulz: Like, your parents had to sit with that for a second.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. They, they... I think they knew. They must have known.
Em Schulz: I think they knew.
Christine Schiefer: I don't know.
Em Schulz: Anyway. Wow. Okay. We really derailed. I'm sorry. Moreen and Doreen. That's where we were.
Christine Schiefer: Right. [laughter] Not... Not Moreen and Doreen. Umm... [laughter] These poor girls. I'm like I'm not trying to laugh at the story, obviously. I just, umm, I found the names so like, umm...
Em Schulz: Silly.
Christine Schiefer: So like, umm, I don't know if small town, but like, so '60s, like, I don't know, quirky. Oh...
Em Schulz: Well, four of my best friends growing up were i-identical quadruplets. And they all had names that had no... Nothing to do with each other.
Christine Schiefer: Oh.
Em Schulz: And which like, I appreciate in knowing them because they, they are their own individual people. But for the novelty, which is so gross, I don't think of them as a novelty. But for... [laughter] Like how often do you get to meet quadruplets and you're like, there's gotta be...
Christine Schiefer: When, when Ringling Brothers Circus picks them up, what are we gonna put on the...
Em Schulz: Yeah, you know...
Christine Schiefer: On the plaque? We've gotta change their name to something that rhymes.
Em Schulz: If they're listening, I don't think of you like that at all. They know that.
Christine Schiefer: Em, we all know that!
Em Schulz: I just, I, just I feel like... They know that. I promise they know that.
Christine Schiefer: I'm just tea... We all know that, we're just teasing.
Em Schulz: And just like, I'm like, in an opportunity where there's four people, you know, it's like their first thought is like, maybe throw...
Christine Schiefer: Well...
Em Schulz: Throw a fun theme on it, but I get, I get why now.
Christine Schiefer: So, but when you think that way, do you mean like they should all ha... Start with the same letter or is it more like they should rhyme or is it more like they should all be like flowers? Like how do you look at that?
Em Schulz: Oh. I see. I don't know 'cause...
Christine Schiefer: Like what's your twin, you know?
Em Schulz: I don't know. Uh, 'cause I, my first thought, I think because we all saw like cartoon twins that like everything rhymed. My first thought is rhyming, which is maybe a little too obvious.
Christine Schiefer: Right. Moreen, Doreen, Floreen.
Em Schulz: I've always liked the idea of doing like, like a color theme or like something kind of subtle, where like it's not totally clumping them together or something.
Christine Schiefer: [chuckle] Oh, I know. You put, you, you know those, umm, those paint, paint chip sample thingies, from like Sherwin-Williams?
Em Schulz: Oh!
Christine Schiefer: You pan it out and then you pick one, you just go down the list...
Em Schulz: They'd be different... Pantone's? Oh my god. That's so...
Christine Schiefer: It would be like, it's not even Pantone's. It's like, uh, thanks... It's like Cranberry Sauce Red or whatever the fuck all the colors are. Umm.
Em Schulz: Like if, uh, so the Duggars, for example, those... That's 19 kids...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, that one's rough.
Em Schulz: That were all born under a name theme. And some of them decided to do name themes...
Christine Schiefer: It's just J, right?
Em Schulz: Just J. Which like, I'm cool with that. It's like, that's different enough maybe, I don't know.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. It's fine. But it's not even like that interest... I'm like...
Em Schulz: Yeah, I'm also talking to someone without a single sibling, let alone an identical one but... [laughter] Umm, so I can't speak to that.
Christine Schiefer: I just like, I'm annoyed that they made the name Jinger start with a J. I think that's so irritating. That's my only gripe.
Em Schulz: There were so many other names they could have gone with, but, and Jinger's number six, like, it's not like they ran out of names...
Christine Schiefer: Wait, uh, they had a whole... Yeah, exactly. I, I always was annoyed by that.
Em Schulz: But, like, one of them decided that they're gonna do an alphabet theme. One of them decided, so it's like A, B, C, D, E, F, G... Uh.
Christine Schiefer: Okay.
Em Schulz: One of them decided they were gonna do an M theme, letter... The letter M. Umm, so like... So I feel like I would like...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, Owen and Oliver? Oliver, right?
Em Schulz: Yeah. Which I don't even know if I meant to do an O theme. I just liked both of those names separately. And I was like, oh, if I had twins, it'd be cool if I could name them both that. And then I get a name theme incidentally.
Christine Schiefer: The double Os?
Em Schulz: Yeah. Anyway. I'm sorry, I just keep interrupting you.
Christine Schiefer: Oh no, I am not stopping it from happening, so...
Em Schulz: Okay. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: It's all good. Uh, okay. I I would argue I'm probably complicit. Oh, by the way, I meant to add, I think that I did not mean the word accessory earlier.
Em Schulz: Thi... We... This is a lot of back and forth on a word from forever ago. [laughter]
Christine Schiefer: I know, but I just feel like people are gonna be like, it's a true crime podcast. And I...
Em Schulz: Oh, you mean complicit, the word complicit? Is that what you're saying?
Christine Schiefer: No, but then later, I said, oh, I think we were trying to come up with the word accessory.
Em Schulz: Accessory.
Christine Schiefer: And then I also realized, I don't think that's correct either. So, Eva, please let me know. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Whatever the word is, that's what we meant.
Christine Schiefer: For when you know about a murder, but you don't tell anybody.
Em Schulz: When you have intel and now you're obligated to say something, or else you are now part of the crime.
Christine Schiefer: What's it called?
Em Schulz: Complicit. No?
Christine Schiefer: God, it's...
Em Schulz: No.
Christine Schiefer: No... Maybe? I don't know. Okay. Sorry. So she lived in Quebec with her mother, Yvonne, her two younger sisters, Moreen and Doreen, the twins, of course, and her younger brothers, Jojo and Steven. So the whole family was very close with Sharron. She was a very warm-hearted older sister. Umm, being the eldest, she took very good care of her younger siblings. She was extremely compassionate and wanted to be a veterinarian when she grew up.
Em Schulz: Precious.
Christine Schiefer: So sweet. And also something I wanted to be when I grew up. Uh, she was recognized in elementary school for her academics. She worked... She was a STEM girly. She was really good at math and science.
Em Schulz: Ooh.
Christine Schiefer: Umm, in fact, she actually enrolled in like accelerated biology programs to get a jumpstart on her vet school ambitions. Uh, so in high school, she was taking like advanced biology courses, and she was also very active in the community. She was part of the Pointe-Sainte-Charles' Boys and Girls Club when she was six and spent most of her free time there. It was actually considered like her second home...
Em Schulz: Mmm.
Christine Schiefer: And she was also very, very reliable. Like I said, she's a very, very caring older sister. Umm, she would read to her little brothers every night and tell them stories. Uh, she was very good around the house. Basically, just the sweetest little angel that makes this story that much worse.
Em Schulz: Yeah. Sounds like it.
Christine Schiefer: Oh. So, of course, now we get to the tragic part, which is that on the day before Easter in March 1975, Sharron spent the morning at home with her younger siblings, while her mom went shopping for Easter dinner groceries. And the twin sisters, Moreen and Doreen, of course, felt they were too old to search for Easter eggs that year. Remember that, that year where you were like, this is like kiddie stuff, you know.
Em Schulz: Same thing with trick-or-treating.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Which makes me sad. [laughter]
Em Schulz: I never had, I was shamed out of trick-or-treating. I never had a moment...
Christine Schiefer: Me, too.
Em Schulz: Where I was like, I think I'm too old.
Christine Schiefer: I never felt too old for trick-or-treating. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Me either. It, and I, and one of the neighbors was like, oh, aren't you a little old? And I went, oh, well I'm just gonna go fucking jump into the river then. Thank you. Like that's...
Christine Schiefer: Right. I felt the same way. And pe-people were like, you are a high schooler. And I was like, but I love Halloween and candy.
Em Schulz: Also like I was this height, if you've ever met me, I am tall. I was, I was this height in fifth grade. I, so people saw me trick-or-treating and they were like, aren't you a little old? And I was like, no, I'm just a giant.
Christine Schiefer: Oh poor Em.
Em Schulz: Leave me alone. Like, what are you talking about?
Christine Schiefer: [laughter] "Give me my Milk Duds."
Em Schulz: Fee-fi-fo-fum!
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Oh my gosh! I gotta tell Blaise to...
Em Schulz: But that is how it felt...
Christine Schiefer: Drive me to the hospital after this recording.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Oh, god.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: That is probably how I looked at. I was like, give me my M&Ms...
Christine Schiefer: Fifth grade... That's so sad. [laughter] That's the saddest thing I've ever heard. Oh my god!
[laughter]
Em Schulz: But also then, but with Easter, I, I, well, also, I didn't really celebrate Easter a lot, so I think it was so, because I had such a love for Halloween, it hurt when I was too old for that...
Christine Schiefer: Yep. Yeah, yeah.
Em Schulz: But with Easter, I was so removed from it that when, by the time I like went to an Easter egg hunt, I think I looked around, I was like, I think maybe this is for younger kids.
Christine Schiefer: You were like stomping around the Easter eggs...
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Just a giant and his very fragile eggs, just kind of walking around...
Christine Schiefer: And all the squabblers were like, aah!
[laughter]
Em Schulz: I was just red ro... Uh, what is it... Red rovering them, just like knocking them down...
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Why is that the funniest thing I've ever heard?
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Just to give me my tarantula legs... Just give... Just... One step across the yard at a time.
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Oh my god. That's traumatizing. [laughter] Oh, god. I'm so sorry, everyone. I do wanna remind... I know everyone's like, we know why because you took a weed gummy before you recorded. Umm...
Em Schulz: I didn't.
Christine Schiefer: I know you didn't, which is the only reason I'm like... This must actually be very funny because Em is also laughing.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: It is.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, god. I don't wanna say the sad parts... [laughter] I'm having such a good time.
Em Schulz: Well, that's your job, unfortunately.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, man.
Em Schulz: We really did pick a weird career. It's like half the time, I'm having so much fun and the other half the time, I just feel so uncomfortable and sad.
Christine Schiefer: Right. I'm like crying, laughing, and five minutes, I'm gonna be cry-crying. Ugh.
Em Schulz: There was one time we did a show, we did a live show where, umm, I got the giggles right before the horrible part of our show. Like remember that?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Oh yeah. That was really awkward. [laughter]
Em Schulz: That was bad. I didn't know what to do. I like, I just had to make people watch me go... Go through the giggles until...
Christine Schiefer: And like didn't stop.
Em Schulz: 'Cause I was like, I was like, I can't laugh through the next part 'cause we're about to say really awful things.
Christine Schiefer: You, we just had to be like...
Em Schulz: And I couldn't stop laughing.
Christine Schiefer: Pivot and, and just, I don't know, 180 it.
Em Schulz: There was another time on stage where, umm, one of the worst things that could happen to you on stage, I, uh, choked on my own spit in front of a thousand people. You remember that?
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: It was bad.
Em Schulz: You remember that? It was so bad. But...
Christine Schiefer: You, you couldn't like speak for like five straight minutes.
Em Schulz: Anyway, yeah, we pulled it off. But I, in case you were wondering what a live show of ours is like, it's pretty not scripted, even though we claim it to be. So...
Christine Schiefer: We, like, can't control our bodily functions, apparently. Umm... Or Em can't, at least.
Em Schulz: I can't.
Christine Schiefer: Oh. Okay. I'm so sorry about this. I just... Moreen and Doreen are the light of my life, and when I hear that they're too old for an Easter egg hunt, I was just really sad about it. So...
Em Schulz: Were they, were they too tall or... Were they too old or too tall?
Christine Schiefer: They were... I don't know...
Em Schulz: Were they silent or silenced? You know.
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: I... That's a great question. Umm, you know what, uh, TBD. It's in the air. It's up in the air. Okay. So Moreen and Doreen, they're like, we're too old to search for Easter egg hunt or for Easter eggs this year. But the younger brothers, Jojo and Steven, were still all about it. They were very excited about an egg hunt. So Sharron decided she was going to dye and decorate, uh, a couple dozen eggs to hide for the boys so they could have a happy Easter. She boiled some eggs and her mom came home around 3:00 PM, while Sharron was painting them for her younger brothers, which is so sweet. And she and her mother spent a little while in the kitchen, talking about how much they loved spring and the "bubbly feeling," it gave them to see the world come back to life with the warmer weather.
Em Schulz: Oh...
Christine Schiefer: And I know, and...
Em Schulz: Wow.
Christine Schiefer: That would be the last, uh, one of the last conversations she ever had with her mother.
Em Schulz: Ugh.
Christine Schiefer: So, at 4:30 PM, the Reverend from the family's church was visiting before dinner, and Sharron was still painting eggs and asked her mom, umm, oh, you know, I'm almost done with these eggs, but a-afterward I would love to read the boys a book about the Easter Bunny. Do we have any books around here about Easter? And the Reverend, who is visiting, he decides it's his turn to, uh, I don't know, throw his hat in the ring. And he goes, I have a great idea, Sharron. Why don't you, instead tell your little brothers, instead of the Easter Bunny, why don't you tell them all about Christ's resurrection? [laughter]
Em Schulz: Oh my.
Christine Schiefer: This is not your place. She wants to read her brothers a book about the Easter Bunny, and this guy's like, I know, why don't you tell them about god? Okay. You know what? Shut up. [laughter] So, the Reverend says, you should tell them about the resurrection story. My bet... My bet is that he's like, that's real magic.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: You don't need an Easter Bunny. You know? So she says, okay, sure. I'll do that, Reverend. I'll tell them all about Jesus and his bloody death on the cross. So after he left, the family sat down to eat, uh, it was Sharron, her siblings, her grandma, her mom, and her mom's friend, Doug. And they had a good dinner. After dinner, Sharron's childhood best friend showed up to hang out for a bit while Sharron got ready to meet up with some other friends in town. The two girls went to different high schools so they had separate friend groups, but they were still really close with each other. And Sharron agonized over what to wear that night. Her friends were teasing her because she kept changing outfits and couldn't decide. And finally, she settled on taking one of her mom's blouses, [chuckle] and she wore that out, but it was drizzling. It was raining a little bit. Umm, and so she considered wearing something different, but she was only walking five blocks. So in the end, she thought...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: Ah, no, this is fine.
Em Schulz: Yeah. Not a big deal.
Christine Schiefer: I'm just gonna walk fast. No big deal. Five blocks. So, she was going to Marina's restaurant, which was a pizzeria and a popular spot for local teenagers to gather. And this is where Sharron spent a lot of her time with her friends from school. She was also planning on meeting her boyfriend there, along with their friends. So, her friend offered to walk Sharron to the restaurant, but Sharron was like, no, it's fine. It's only five blocks. And, I, you know, she... She went there all the time.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: So she said, no thanks, that's fine. I'll walk myself. And just before 7:00 PM, Sharron said one last goodbye to her mom who said, goodbye, Sharron. Be careful. Which was the same thing Yvonne had always said to her daughter every time she left the house. And it had become a habit.
Em Schulz: Mm.
Christine Schiefer: So, Sharron and her friend parted ways on the sidewalk outside the house, and Sharron headed off to Marina's restaurant by herself at 7:15 PM. So, Sharron, at this point, is 16 years old, and she, on Saturdays, is allowed to stay out till pretty late. So she's usually out till 11:00 or 1:00 AM, and her mom was fine with that as long as she knew where she was, which I think, guess is fair. And Yvonne, her mother, described Sharron as a cautious girl, so she wasn't worried about her when she was out late and said that Sharron went out of her way to avoid trouble and conflict with her peers. And she had never given her a reason to enforce a curfew, basically, because she either always came home on time or she always called if she was gonna be late.
Em Schulz: Sure.
Christine Schiefer: So, this night, of course, something is different, uh, Sharron does not come home nor does she call her mom. And of course, it's immediately obvious that something is wrong. Uh, in fact, Sharron's family soon learned that she never even made it to Marina's restaurant.
Em Schulz: Shit. She never even made it five blocks? Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: Nope. Nope. She had somehow vanished along the five-minute walk between her house and the pizzeria. Five minutes, five blocks.
Em Schulz: Hmm... That's so scary.
Christine Schiefer: Didn't even make it. It's terrifying. And this is from her house. Like it's somewhere she walks from her house at age 16.
Em Schulz: You know, there are a lot of times, umm, I have the thought, even when I'm, when I lived in Boston or when I lived in different areas of California, eventually when some area feels like your neighborhood, you really do get like a false sense of like, oh, everything's fine on these few streets because I see them all the time.
Christine Schiefer: Totally. Totally.
Em Schulz: And then I would have moments where I'm like walking down the street and I'm like, oh no. Like something really bad can happen right now. Like it's, it, it's just jarring when you...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. You kind of lose, you lose like your... Yeah. Yeah. I, I totally agree. And I think even as the parent, like as, umm, Yvonne in this situation, I wouldn't probably think twice about letting my 16-year-old, who's like very mature and responsible, walk five blocks, five minutes.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: I mean, hell, I feel like I was wandering around much younger than that, in much... [laughter]
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: More chaotic directions than five blocks. Uh, so yeah, that's, it's just a really scary thought, how close, how close to home it happened.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: And it wasn't even that late. It was like 7:30.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Like a busy Saturday night. Okay. So someone, when they realized, uh, that we're not a hundred percent sure, but we assume it's her mother, realized she was not home and called the police to report Sharron missing. And at this point, authorities launched a search. There was no sign of Sharron on the route she was supposed to take to Marina's and so, police rallied volunteers and students from Sharron's high school. People came out in droves to look for Sharron. But unfortunately, two days went by with no leads and papers, again, picking the story up.
Em Schulz: Mm.
Christine Schiefer: One headline, for example, read, "Girl, 16, missing for two days." Uh, this was kind of just a story that was catching on in neighboring towns as well. Yvonne told the media that she knew something was terribly wrong, but of course, you know, now with the media attention, people are giving their hot takes and saying things like, oh, she must have run away. Uh, you know, because that's just what people assume about teenagers. But Yvonne went on air and said, absolutely not. She would never have run away. She left her bus pass, first of all, and all her money behind. And also speaking to her friends, her friends had never heard Sharron say anything about running away. And also she was just a genuinely very happy and well-adjusted girl, and loved her family. So it didn't make any sense.
Em Schulz: Right.
Christine Schiefer: Descriptions of Sharron were published, uh, encouraging readers to report any sightings, and yet another day passed with no sign of Sharron. Then on the fourth day, since she had disappeared, a local beekeeper was out in a field, uh, and made a tragic discovery when he noticed the fence gate was open and went in to investigate.
Em Schulz: Hmm.
Christine Schiefer: Behind the fence, he found Sharron deceased. And when authorities arrived, the medical examiner estimated that she had been dead for about 20 hours.
Em Schulz: Oh, man.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: There's something about within a 24-hour timeframe, it's like, it was so, so close, she could have...
Christine Schiefer: It's, it's horrible. It's horrible because that also means she was alive for several days.
Em Schulz: Oh my god. Yeah. Oh god!
Christine Schiefer: She's been missing for four.
Em Schulz: Right.
Christine Schiefer: So investigators theorized, she must have been held somewhere for several days before she was killed and abandoned in the field. They found a branch clutched in her hand. Umm, and when they took a look at her body and at the environment, they determined that she was still alive when she had been brought to the field.
Em Schulz: Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. It's... It's incredibly dark and I'm, I'm just so sorry... Umm, there was some tape dangling from Sharron's hair that she had chewed, which was evidence that she had been probably gagged.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: It was also evident from a glance that she had been beaten really badly, umm, and an autopsy revealed that she had been raped before suffering multiple skull fractures. Her jaw and cheek were also fractured. Her nose was broken, and, umm, I'm about to tell you how she ultimately passed away.
Em Schulz: Okay.
Christine Schiefer: Uh, she died of asphyxiation when the killer crushed her chest, likely with his knee. Yeah.
Em Schulz: Gasp. Gasp.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah.
Em Schulz: Oh my god!
Christine Schiefer: And this was all in that field where he then just left her.
Em Schulz: So do we think he planned to kill her or was it an "accident"?
Christine Schiefer: No, no. He, he intentionally killed her...
Em Schulz: Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: Uh, by crushing her, crushing her chest. Umm.
Em Schulz: Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: So when this kind of last blow occurred, her lungs hemorrhaged and filled with blood, and that's how she ultimately officially passed away. So, of course, this is the most brutal, horrifying thing for anyone in town to imagine happening, uh, at all, let alone in their town, so close to their homes. And they thought, who the hell in our community could be so heinous and could be capable of something like this? So, of course, authorities, this is number one priority, but they didn't really have much to go on. When they looked around, they found a single tire track in the snow near Sharron's body. They found one footprint. Umm, there was no snow or mud on Sharron's shoes, which meant she had probably been carried, uh, and placed there.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm. So, she could have been like, uh, asleep or drugged or something, or just... Or just held to...
Christine Schiefer: Probably just that she had been, you know, held and tortured...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: For several days or yeah, I imagine she was probably not...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: I don't know.
Em Schulz: Taking care of her [1:32:00.6] ____.
Christine Schiefer: Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. In a place where she could hold her own. Yeah. So, there was also a trail of blood leading to Sharron's body, umm, which made it appear as though she had been beaten in the vehicle before being dropped in the field.
Em Schulz: Mm.
Christine Schiefer: They also found her jeans on the ground, a few feet away from her. Uh, her underwear was hanging on a tree branch, which feels just extra, like sicko, I don't know...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Leaving some sort of weird message. A men's shirt probably used to restrain Sharron was also dumped at the scene and its size suggested that the suspect was roughly six feet tall and the single footprint belonged to a size 8 1/2 men's shoe. And the footprint itself was pretty deep.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: Which was another detail that led investigators to believe that this was a larger person. There was a theory that there were two men involved in the killing, umm, but people weren't entirely agreed on that. The padlock on the gate had not been tampered with. It was unclear whether the gate was simply left unlocked or maybe if the killer had keys to the gate, which would've like narrowed down, obviously, a suspect pool. And nobody in town, not one single person, came forward with information. So they, that was basically the entirety of clues or information they had to go on.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: So, investigators believed somebody had to know something, as the saying goes, because Sharron had been abducted off a residential street, like right down the street...
Em Schulz: I don't know where.
Christine Schiefer: From her house.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: On Saturday evening, over Easter weekend, when all these people were home with their families and were out and about, but not a single person came forward. And so, people... Or police were very, very, I don't know, just perplexed by this. So they questioned 38 people, uh, but they got no closer to a single lead and we don't really understand why, but Sharron's boyfriend was either never a suspect or he was ruled out really quickly. Umm, but there's no evidence that he was actually investigated for the murder...
Em Schulz: I wonder for like Easter break, he was like, he was at his grandma's or something, like there was a...
Christine Schiefer: Yeah, well, remember she was supposed to meet him that night, so I wonder if...
Em Schulz: Oh, right.
Christine Schiefer: Like he might have already been out with his friends, you know? And they were like...
Em Schulz: You know, enough people were like, I saw him at the pizza place together.
Christine Schiefer: Like we were together... Yeah. He couldn't have grabbed her... Yeah. So, I don't know. I feel like it would...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Probably be easy to rule him out.
Em Schulz: It sounds like it must have been someone she knew, if no one witnessed a struggle or if they did see her with someone, it was someone she knew so they didn't... Never clocked it or something. That's...
Christine Schiefer: And that's the wildest part, is they basically interviewed anyone they could think of, who would know her, would be in the area. And they got nowhere closer to an answer. Very, very perplexing. So, soon, a troubling report came out about an attack that happened the same night Sharron disappeared, perhaps just minutes earlier.
Em Schulz: Hmm. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: 23... What?
Em Schulz: I said, oh, okay.
Christine Schiefer: Oh. I thought... [chuckle] I thought you said hey. And I was like...
Em Schulz: No, no, no, no. I was like...
Christine Schiefer: So-sorry.
Em Schulz: Oh, we're onto something.
Christine Schiefer: 23-year-old Cheryl Roy was walking to the pharmacy to pick up diapers for her infant daughter, when she passed a man she described as pretty normal-looking, didn't ring any alarm bells or raise any red flags. And after they'd passed one another, she kind of was just going about her business and she suddenly heard hurried footsteps getting louder and coming toward her. And she turned just in time to see that same "normal man" barreling toward her.
Em Schulz: Oh, shit.
Christine Schiefer: He shoved her against the wall of a building and put a knife to her neck. And Cheryl, realizing this man was not gonna let her go, began to fight back. Uh, she actually got her hand and neck both cut in the struggle. And at this point, out of her mind, terrified, Cheryl told him to take her purse. But he told her... Ooh... Goosecam... He told her, I don't want your purse. I want you. I love you.
Em Schulz: Ugh. Gasp. Oh no! So we've got a stalker situation maybe?
Christine Schiefer: Ugh. Ugh. I guess so. I mean, she definitely didn't know who he was. So, he shoved Cheryl to the ground and dragged her by her hair toward an empty lot. He told her in what she described as a low calm voice, and I say that because that makes this just that much creepier. In a low, calm voice, he dragged her by her hair into an empty lot and said, "You are dead. You're not getting away from me. When I get through with you I'll cut you to pieces."
Em Schulz: Gasp. Oh my god. What the fuck? Whoa.
Christine Schiefer: It's just horrifying. So, Cheryl fought and fought. The man, at one point, dropped his knife in the struggle, and Cheryl was able to kick it away. And she...
Em Schulz: Good job.
Christine Schiefer: Screamed through the entire attack, which lasted an excruciating six minutes.
Em Schulz: Ugh.
Christine Schiefer: She screamed bloody murder until a group of local boys rushed to the scene. And Cheryl recognized one of the boys and called out to him specifically. And at this, the attacker jumped away from Cheryl and ran off, cutting through a lane that just so happened to be on Sharron's walking route to the pizzeria.
Em Schulz: Oh my god. Okay. Well...
Christine Schiefer: And the time of that attack was 7:00 PM.
Em Schulz: Yep. So...
Christine Schiefer: And she parted ways with her friend at 7:15.
Em Schulz: That'll do it.
Christine Schiefer: It's horri-horrifying. I mean, it's almost like... Talk about butterfly effect, like the things that had to align for that intersection to happen just like that.
Em Schulz: And imagine, like the Cheryl, Cheryl role, imagine Cheryl's like guilt, like survivor's guilt of like, because I survived...
Christine Schiefer: Oh, yeah.
Em Schulz: Another person got...
Christine Schiefer: Like, right. I fought her...
Em Schulz: Which like it's not her fault, but it's, it's...
Christine Schiefer: No, not at all. And it's hard because you wanna be like, of course, like Cheryl kicked ass and like fought hard and whatever...
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: But that's not to say, you know, Sharron didn't.
Em Schulz: Well, I would've frozen so, it...
Christine Schiefer: Right.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: And like, who knows, maybe, I mean, she may have fought for her life, but maybe she just wasn't as lucky. Maybe. I don't know.
Em Schulz: Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: It's horrifying.
Em Schulz: Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: So, that was basically, obviously, a humongous break in the case. At least it was, uh, it would've been, umm...
Em Schulz: Oh. What?
Christine Schiefer: We'll get there. Okay.
Em Schulz: Christine?
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Well, remember when I said it was a formerly cold case?
Em Schulz: Uh-huh. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: It, it hasn't gotten cold yet, but we're... We'll get there.
Em Schulz: So it hasn't even gotten warm again?
Christine Schiefer: No. It hasn't even gotten cold for the first time yet. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Jesus. Oh my god. Okay. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: So now they're thinking, okay, maybe Sharron's killer went after her right after going for Cheryl and failing that abduction. So, Cheryl did say that her attacker was about 4 inches taller than her, which would be about 6 foot 1. So that would've matched, uh, around 29 years old and White, with blue eyes and a mustache. And he spoke English without a French accent, which is notable because we are in Montreal.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: She also noted, he did not smell like alcohol, which I thought was interesting. I don't know.
Em Schulz: Maybe it was her way of being like, he wasn't... Sounded like he was drunk and he just freaked out.
Christine Schiefer: Oh, sure. Yeah. That's fair. That's fair. After the attack, Cheryl actually lost her voice for two whole days. She couldn't speak...
Em Schulz: Oh my god. Oh.
Christine Schiefer: Because she had screamed so much. But days went by and then months with, even though this huge break in the case or so they thought had happened, uh, there was no news on Sharron's killer or Cheryl's attacker, and the case went cold. And then years passed, decades passed, and we arrive in 2004. So this is 29 years after the murder. Somebody calls in a tip to the police about a garage behind an apartment building in Sharron's neighborhood. And although the details of the tip are vague, police reopened the case and were reportedly searching the garage for DNA or maybe any other evidence that Sharron had been held inside this garage.
Em Schulz: Oh shit. Okay. Why did so... Wait, why did someone call in a tip?
Christine Schiefer: So someone basically just called in a tip and said, like, regarding the Sharron Prior case, you should look into that garage.
Em Schulz: Weird. That feels like there's context to that, that I'm not getting.
Christine Schiefer: It's very weird. Yes.
Em Schulz: Okay. Like what... That, in my mind, it feels like someone just moved in, happened to know that case, and then was like, here's my garage. Do you wanna play around in there and see what you find?
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: Do you wanna play around in there... I...
Em Schulz: It feels like there's gotta be something... I'm like, it's like, was there a note or something? I don't know. It's...
Christine Schiefer: I don't know. And I, I wonder, I wonder if they're just not releasing the information. Like maybe there is a more specific tip. Like maybe somebody called in and said like, oh, my grandpa used to live in that house and he just died, and he was super creepy. Check out his garage. I don't know. Umm...
Em Schulz: Yeah. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Like may-maybe Canada... Canadian laws, they're just not releasing the specific tip. I have no idea. We just...
Em Schulz: Sure. But that, that makes sense. Like maybe you heard something creepy happened there, so maybe just like, have someone over.
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Maybe you just had, you heard some story or who knows. But yeah, it said it was a very vague tip. Umm, and or at least we have very vague details about what the tip said, but apparently it was enough to get them to reopen the case and go and search the garage. So, Yvonne, who was still alive, this was Sharron's mother, told reporters that she had waited 29 years for a break in the case and that she had never lost hope. She wanted to look her daughter's killer in the eyes and demand answers. But unfortunately, despite everyone's kind of excitement about this, the search of the garage yielded no new evidence. But the case stayed open now. So now that they had opened it, at least, you know, they could continue investigating it. And they offered a $10,000 reward for information. So, in 2012, Yvonne told reporters, I was 37 years old when this happened to my daughter. You can count. I'm 74 now. I can't believe that I'm still waiting for this to be solved.
Em Schulz: Ugh.
Christine Schiefer: Oof!
Em Schulz: That's awful.
Christine Schiefer: So, twice her life, double.
Em Schulz: [1:43:15.2] ____ literally, I was gonna say that's like twice her life. Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: Horrifying. Police pursued over 100 suspects. They were all dead ends, and it just seemed less and less likely that Yvonne would ever get the answers she so desperately needed. But, umm, do we know what solved this case? What finally cracked it wide open?
Em Schulz: Staples in the butt. [laughter] What? I don't know, what, what?
Christine Schiefer: That would be a really good Mad Libs answer. Next time you play Mad Libs, staple in the butt.
Em Schulz: Umm. Was it, umm, I don't know... Did some... Did a wit... Did a witness finally come forward? What?
Christine Schiefer: Genetic genealogy.
Em Schulz: Oh. Of course. Yes. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: Genetic gene... Sorry... Of like genetic genealogy. There we go. Uh, yes. Yes. Just like Golden State Killer, advances in DNA, we're able to finally get a break going in this case. Investigators were able to use samples taken from the men's shirt that had been used to bind Sharron and...
Em Schulz: Oh.
Christine Schiefer: Some DNA also from her own clothes that she'd been wearing. And they were able to search through ancestry databases and they found potential matches in the Romine family of West Virginia.
Em Schulz: Oh.
Christine Schiefer: So, police started digging through criminal records and eventually, honed in on a man named Franklin Maywood Romine. And Franklin, who had been born in 1946, of course, had a long history of violence and had escaped West Virginia Penitentiary in 1967. He had then bounced back and forth between Canada and West Virginia to avoid capture by police. And in 1974, he broke into a house and raped a woman in Parkersburg, West Virginia. And he was arrested and imprisoned for that, but was released on bond and he fled once again to Canada where he lived for a while, right near Sharron Prior.
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: So, several months after Sharron was killed, Franklin was arrested in Canada and extradited to West Virginia where he was sentenced to 5 to 10 years for the previous rape that he had been, uh, arrested for. He was released and then died in Canada in 1982, under vague circumstances, so we kind of don't know what the hell happened.
Em Schulz: Sure, okay.
Christine Schiefer: But he died in 1982. His family buried him in Putnam County, West Virginia. And of course, his history made him a major person of interest. And it turned out that his car matched the tire track, that one single tire track found near Sharron's body.
Em Schulz: Wow. Okay. So solved?
Christine Schiefer: Yeah. Almost. So his appearance at the time also matched Cheryl's description of her attacker. And Franklin's two brothers volunteered their own DNA samples. And according to court documents, the results showed that it is "140 million times more likely to come from the brother of Noah and Michael Romine than any other random person in the Caucasian population."
Em Schulz: Holy shit. Okay.
Christine Schiefer: So, yes, to answer your question, fucking solved.
Em Schulz: Wow.
Christine Schiefer: Although they believed their brother was guilty, both men had hoped their own DNA was enough to confirm Franklin's crime. Umm, he, apparently, Franklin had once attempted to rape one of his brother's wives.
Em Schulz: Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: And after that happened, understandably, the family kind of cut ties with him.
Em Schulz: Uh-huh, quite... Quite understandable.
Christine Schiefer: But they did not want, uh, despite the, this, you know, cutting him out of the family, he was still buried right near their mother. And so, they did not want his body to be exhumed, because doing so would probably disturb her grave.
Em Schulz: Uh-huh. Gotcha.
Christine Schiefer: And so they were very, uh, adamant that they did not want his body to be exhumed, but investigators kind of had that overridden...
Em Schulz: Mm-hmm.
Christine Schiefer: And they promised to protect the other grave in the process. And if they did damage it, they promised to restore it completely. I I don't think that ever became an issue, but...
Em Schulz: Okay.
Christine Schiefer: Fun facts.
Em Schulz: Well it's nice of them to offer, I guess.
Christine Schiefer: Uh, I thought so too. I was like, that's, that's fair point. Yeah. Advances in DNA science allowed specialists to retrieve a viable sample from Franklin's bones, which is just crazy, and it was a match. They had found Sharron's killer.
Em Schulz: Wow!
Christine Schiefer: So this was the news the Priors had been waiting for, for nearly 48 years.
Em Schulz: Oh my god.
Christine Schiefer: Such a long time.
Em Schulz: And did Yvonne find... I was gonna say, did her mom at least get to hear about this?
Christine Schiefer: Yes. She was alive.
Em Schulz: Okay.
Christine Schiefer: I'm so happy to tell you, she was alive because back in 2004, she was so enthusiastic that like, this could be the answer, you know? And then, after that, it looked like nothing would ever happen. So she did get the answers she had been waiting for. Umm, she finally knew who had killed her daughter nearly half a century earlier. And thankfully, the family had never given up hope. They had been running a blog and website in Sharron's name, umm, where they would post updates and write about her. A scholarship has since been founded in Sharron's memory, and one of Sharron's sisters addressed Sharron, while speaking with interviewers saying, "You may never have come back to our house on Congregation Street that weekend, but you have never left our hearts and you never will. We love you, Sharron."
Em Schulz: Mm.
Christine Schiefer: "May you now truly rest in peace."
Em Schulz: Wow.
Christine Schiefer: And that's the...
Em Schulz: Okay, at least it was solved.
Christine Schiefer: No longer cold case of Sharron Prior.
Em Schulz: I guess that's all you can ask for, after literally 50 years.
Christine Schiefer: I know. I know. It's, uh, it's, it, it gives hope though, you know, that these advances in technology might keep coming.
Em Schulz: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Whew. Well, good storytelling, Christine. Bad story. Good storytelling.
Christine Schiefer: Thank you, same to... Same to you.
[laughter]
Em Schulz: Uh, how are you feeling? What's the update on your... Everything?
Christine Schiefer: I mean, I'm definitely feeling, umm, pretty chill now with the...
Em Schulz: Weed?
Christine Schiefer: With the Delta-9 gummy. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Okay. That's good.
Christine Schiefer: That actually, it really does... It really does work. My joints don't hurt anymore.
Em Schulz: Aw, you poor thing. It's like ha-having a podcast with my grandma. Just...
[laughter]
Christine Schiefer: You've always said that about me.
Em Schulz: Yeah. Umm, okay. Well, I'm glad you're feeling good. Are you, are you up for an after hours?
Christine Schiefer: Oh, absolutely. Let's go party. Yeah. If you guys wanna join us for our after hours chat, which is usually, well actually it's kind of chaotic, but it's meant to be true crime paranormal updates, sometimes goes a little off the rails.
Em Schulz: It, it ends up being general updates, personal updates, sometimes true crime themes, sometimes paranormal themes, sometimes just us hanging out, sometimes we take chatting.
Christine Schiefer: Or we... A lot of times, we take personality quizzes or we like guess each other's, like, we play like newlywed style games or... Or we...
Em Schulz: We tell secrets.
Christine Schiefer: We tell secrets. That's true. We read Em's Kids' Club, uh, [laughter] Kids' Club rules.
Em Schulz: Ugh, my, my uh, the admissions... Or the admissions, right? Yeah.
Christine Schiefer: The manifesto is what I called it. [laughter]
Em Schulz: Well, let's see what...
Christine Schiefer: Or we played your, uh, your Jeopardy game last... One... One of those times, too.
Em Schulz: Oh yeah. Yeah. All right, well if you wanna...
Christine Schiefer: Anyway, it's a good time. Come join us.
Em Schulz: Continue on our bullshit, yeah, you're more than welcome to. And, umm, I guess, come see us on tour. We're halfway through our tour, so if you want a chance at seeing, uh, On The Rocks before we have a whole new show, you've got about 10 shows left.
Christine Schiefer: Clock's ticking.
Em Schulz: And.
Christine Schiefer: That's.
Em Schulz: Why.
Christine Schiefer: We.
Em Schulz: Drink.
